The Most Interesting Thing in AI

The AI Jobs Disruption - Erik Brynjolfsson with Nicholas Thompson 27.05.2026 1t 2min

Of all the potential risks and promises of AI, perhaps none are as immediately dire as this: How will it impact jobs? Will employers still need workers? What will it mean if the answer is “no?” Depending on who you’re talking to, the prospect of a future with fewer jobs is either liberating or terrifying. But for a more measured reaction, it helps to look at the data. Stanford economist Erik Bynjolfsson has done just that, drilling down into AI’s effects on employment, upskilling, output, and more. In a conversation with The Atlantic’s CEO Nichlas Thompson, Brynjolfsson goes through his studies of call centers and other AI-exposed fields, and the surprising findings that could bring some much-needed reality to our fears. (00:00) Introduction to Erik Brynjolfsson and his work on AI economics (02:51) How much is free AI actually worth? (05:25) Why isn’t powerful AI showing up in GDP? (06:48) Introducing GDP-B: A new metric to capture value from free digital goods (07:23) Why initial AI adoption often lowers output (09:05) Evidence of the J-curve turning: Call centers, software, and aggregate stats (14:48) Will AI create more jobs or destroy them? Understanding elastic vs. inelastic demand (19:36) Advice for students and workers: Focus on creating new value, not just efficiency (21:34) Why AI helps different skill levels differently in call centers vs. coding (25:47) The "Turing Trap": Why mimicking humans leads to substitution rather than augmentation (30:50) Four policy recommendations: Better metrics, dynamic labor markets, and human-AI complementarity (37:52) "Canaries in the Coal Mine": Data showing early job displacement in AI-exposed fields (47:08) How higher labor costs drive automation adoption (52:53) Fair compensation for creators: Designing incentives for the AI-content ecosystem (59:03) The urgent need to study the transition, not just the technology Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Limits of Predictive AI - Carissa Véliz with Nicholas Thompson 20.05.2026 48min

Can AI predict a person’s future? It’s a promise often made by sales teams, but the technology’s record is far from spotless. Even if it did achieve perfect foresight, a practically-clairvoyant AI might be incompatible with democracy, says Oxford philosopher Carissa Véliz. In a spirited conversation with Nicholas Thompson, CEO of The Atlantic, Véliz traces the history of predictions from ancient oracles to the modern algorithms shaping everything from criminal sentencing to insurance premiums. What are the ethics of outsourcing such consequential decisions to machines? The risks of getting it wrong are obvious. Véliz warns of the dangers of getting it right. (00:00) Introduction to Carissa Véliz and her work on privacy and AI (01:29) Why "less crime" is an illusion of safety (02:30) How surveillance machinery enables prediction and social control (03:06) Defense of autonomy: why resisting surveillance protects freedom (04:02) Can mass surveillance ever be beneficial? (05:36) Ring cameras and the erosion of democratic anonymity (07:01) Prediction versus prophecy: how forecasts shape reality (08:52) Job displacement predictions and self-fulfilling prophecies (13:15) The Gettier problem: why probabilistic AI lacks justification (16:06) When probabilistic AI works and when it fails (18:52) Do individualized health predictions defeat the purpose of insurance? (25:24) Areas where probabilistic reasoning is inadequate: insurance, justice (27:48) The problems of effective altruism and utilitarian calculation (32:37) AI company ethics: copyright, rights, and virtue ethics (37:47) Can more data solve "the turkey problem?" (39:15) Practical privacy advice: Signal, Proton, VPN, and mindful choices Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

AI Utopia or Catastrophe? Nick Bostrom with Nicholas Thompson 13.05.2026 48min

Will AI destroy the world, or transform it into one of abundance? Across two books and several papers, philosopher Nick Bostrom has envisioned a range of AI futures. He joins Nicholas Thompson to discuss the ethics of how we treat AI, whether AI has sentience, and why he believes we should keep building, even at the risk of annihilation. Produced in collaboration with PwC. (00:00) Introduction to Nick Bostrom and Superintelligence (01:56) How AI development matched Bostrom's predictions (04:48) Recursive self-improvement: Are we there yet? (07:40) Physical limits of intelligence and computational ceilings (09:40) Timeline predictions: Next year vs. next five years (11:46) Embodied intelligence: Can AI replicate motor skills? (14:32) Centralization vs. democratization of AI power (16:52) The race dynamics: One leader vs many competitors (19:57) AI alignment: Making systems behave as intended (21:37) The gap between model power and our understanding (23:25) "Optimal Timing for Superintelligence" paper explained (28:14) Swift to harbor, slow to berth: When to pause AI development (35:20) Moral status of digital minds and sentience (41:23) Building trust with potentially misaligned AI (44:11) Where to invest unlimited AI research funding (47:07) Closing: Should we say please and thank you to AI? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Case for Open-Source AI - with Nicholas Thompson and Raffi Krikorian 06.05.2026 54min

Why does AI answer the way it does? Even as models cite their sources, the question of “why” remains one of the most confounding in the industry, with huge implications for users and builders alike. Mozilla CTO Raffi Krikorian says much of the answer lies in open-source AI— letting users look under the hood to see what’s happening. It’s a compelling idea, one that could also impact safety and alignment. But can it thrive? And what are the risks of ceding control? In a deep conversation with Atlantic CEO Nicholas Thompson, Raffi describes a world where technology is liberated from a handful of corporations, shares his hopes and fears for AI, and reflects on his recent car crash involving a self-driving Tesla. (00:00) Introduction: The mystery of AI decision-making and the need for transparency (02:25) Twitter, Uber, and the DNC: Raffi’s career history (05:01) How centralization changed Twitter into X (08:30) Why seven companies shouldn't control AGI (11:38) Mozilla's mission: Building an open AI ecosystem like Firefox did for the web (14:21) Is it strange that Google funds Firefox? (16:40) The four layers of AI openness: Compute, data, models, and developer tooling (22:20) Data ethics and provenance: Creating markets for ethically-sourced training data (26:44) What counts as “true” open-source AI? (32:04) The risks of open source AI: Balancing accessibility with safety concerns (35:56) Should powerful AI be restricted like nuclear weapons? (39:17) Raffi's Tesla crash and the danger of automated complacency (46:56) Preserving humanity in the age of AI: Avoiding the "WALL-E" future Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Sam Altman on Where AI Models Go Next, with Nicholas Thompson 29.04.2026 53min

OpenAI’s Sam Altman sits for an interview with Nicholas Thompson, CEO of The Atlantic, to discuss AI’s trustworthiness, its dangers, and its impact on young people. Altman also discusses his company’s pledge to “stop competing and start assisting” rival projects that approach AGI, and why he thinks we’re not there yet. In a thorough and wide-ranging conversation, Altman opens up about where he thinks AI will go next and the mysteries that he still can’t solve. Recorded at OpenAI’s offices in San Francisco. (00:00) Introduction (02:33) Is our understanding of AI keeping pace with its growth in power? (05:10) Is chain-of-thought the key to trusting a model? (11:07) Open source AI, cybersecurity, and "infected" agents (16:26) Have we hit recursive self-improvement? (19:18) What does AI do on Sam Altman's computer? (21:15) Why hasn't AI made an impact in business yet? (24:04) Will AI make the wealth gap worse? (27:01) Why do young people hate AI? (30:23) The challenges of AI sycophancy (33:36) Do you regret making AI so human-like? (36:53) Synthetic data and "mad cow disease" (39:22) The future of publishing and media (41:54) Do we need neurosymbolic AI? (43:40) Will you cooperate with Anthropic if they get to AGI first? (47:42) What is your advice to parents who are anxious for their kids' future? (49:46) If you had infinite resources, what would you pursue?? Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Data Centers in Space - with Nicholas Thompson and Ariel Ekblaw 22.04.2026 39min

AI needs data centers, and those data centers need energy and cooling. Recently, one proposal has captured the popular imagination: put data centers in space, where there’s ample solar energy and naturally cool surroundings. But things aren’t quite that simple, says space architect Ariel Ekblaw of the Aurelia Institute. On this episode of The Most Interesting Thing in AI, Ekblaw talks with The Atlantic CEO Nicholas Thompson about the possibilities for building structures in space, the innovative designs coming out of the Aurelia Institute, and why data centers in space are a good idea… for certain billionaires. Produced in collaboration with PwC. (00:00) Introduction (02:22) What is a space architect? (04:45) How does someone become a space architect? (07:39) How do "space Magna-Tiles" work? (11:00) Why build in space? (12:45) Will we have chatbots in space? (15:00) How space will change robotics (16:56) Why would anyone want to live in space? (19:55) Will we actually go to space soon? (20:49) Artificial gravity Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Season 4 Trailer 15.04.2026

Where does AI go next? And what happens to us? Join The Atlantic’s CEO Nicholas Thompson as he speaks with leaders, developers, philosophers, and more about AI’s impacts, present and future. New episodes every Wednesday, starting April 22. Produced in collaboration with PwC. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Copyright Wars - with Nicholas Thompson and Bill Gross 26.11.2025 36min

In this episode, The Atlantic’s CEO Nicholas Thompson speaks with serial entrepreneur and Idealab founder Bill Gross about his latest venture, ProRata, a bold attempt to create a fair exchange of value between AI companies and the creators whose work helped train their models. From inventing search advertising to tackling one of AI’s most urgent ethical challenges, Gross explains how innovation and fair market dynamics can align—and how humans are still underestimating the transformative power of AI. (00:00) Introduction (06:32) How Bill invented paid search in the 1990s (13:29) NYT v. OpenAI as the “lightning strike moment” that inspired ProRata (16:16) Solving the “impossible problem” of AI attribution (21:36) ProRata’s plan for revenue sharing between creators and AI companies (24:13) How YouTube shows revenue sharing could make AI companies even stronger (28:20) When there will be a one-person company with a billion-dollar valuation (29:23) AI could be net positive for the climate in as little as five years (33:01) The most interesting way Bill has used AI recently Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Building Trustworthy AI - with Nicholas Thompson and Navrina Singh 19.11.2025 37min

What happens when AI learns faster than its makers can control? In this episode, Nicholas talks with Navrina Singh, founder and CEO of Credo AI, about how regulation could actually accelerate innovation of more responsible, transparent AI. Together, they dig into how governance can help the U.S. compete with China, prevent bias, and keep trust and transparency at the center of the AI revolution. (00:00) Introduction (04:09) What we learned from Microsoft’s Tay disaster (06:58) Why Navrina started Credo AI (11:12) Managing risk across the AI supply chain (12:43) Preventing bias in customer support chatbots (17:54) Is AI making the world less equal? (19:40) Ethics vs. speed in the AI race with China (21:40) How governance leads to better, faster products (28:04) Why there’s no perfect AI regulation right now (31:14) Preparing for a world where AI governs itself (34:15) The most interesting way Navrina has used AI Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

AI in Flight - with Nicholas Thompson, Tory Bruno and Joe Schurman 12.11.2025 39min

The space race has gone private, and in this new world, efficiency is key. United Launch Alliance CEO Tory Bruno explains how a legacy rocket maker remade itself to compete in an industry full of startups. From load analysis and low-earth-orbit satellite monitoring to rockets with autonomous flight systems, Bruno unpacks what happens when machine learning meets computational fluid dynamics in our atmosphere. Plus, why AI might be critical to landing a man on Mars—and getting them home alive. (00:00) Introduction (01:38) From backyard rockets to Boeing and Lockheed (Tory Bruno) (03:58) Transforming ULA for a new space race (06:09) The physics of launch: energy, precision, and peril (08:41) Reprogramming flight paths with AI (10:55) The coming age of autonomous and reusable rockets (16:27) When we'll really send humans to Mars—and bring them back (19:36) How AI could help us find, and talk to, alien life (29:20) AI in the space economy (Joe Schurman) (34:16) The $2 trillion future of space (37:51) The most interesting way Joe has used AI Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Artificial Life - with Nicholas Thompson and Lee Cronin 05.11.2025 26min

How do you digitize the physical world? In this episode, Nick talks with University of Glasgow chemistry professor Lee Cronin, founder of Chemify—a company that is using AI to turn molecules to code s—about his quest to create a programming language for chemistry, what it means to “print” molecules, and how his team is able to discover new drugs and materials through their “chemputer.” He also discusses how the work is offering new insights into the origins of life on Earth and how to identify it on other planets. (00:00) Introduction (01:45) From setting fires to studying life (05:00) Creating a programming language for chemistry (09:20) Designing and “printing” new molecules (10:45) How hype has distorted AI’s promise (14:17) From sand to cells: the origin of life (16:01) Assembly theory and the bridge from nonlife to life (19:15) What it would take for AI to come alive (23:48) The most interesting way Lee has used AI Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The Future of AI at Work - with Nicholas Thompson and Matt Wood 29.10.2025 28min

What does it take to succeed in the disruptive world of AI? In this episode, Atlantic CEO Nicholas Thompson sits down with Matt Wood, PwC’s Global and U.S. Commercial Technology and Innovation Officer, to trace his path from medical school and protein folding research to Amazon Web Services and now PwC. They discuss the transformative power of AI; why, when disruptive forces emerge, companies may be better off doubling down on their core identity rather than reinventing themselves; and how the organizations of the future may be reshaped by autonomous agents working alongside humans. (00:00) Introduction (02:16) Matt's path from medicine to machine learning (05:47) The Human Genome Project and the data explosion (09:28) The AI inflection point (11:41) Why AI’s biggest impact will be organizational, not technical (13:30) How companies navigate disruption without losing identity (19:18) The coming flattening of organizations (22:02) Managing teams of humans and agents (25:41) The most interesting way Matt has used AI Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

The AI Athlete - with Nicholas Thompson and Will Ahmed 22.10.2025 33min

Can AI unlock your full potential as an athlete? In this episode, Nicholas speaks with Will Ahmed, founder and CEO of Whoop, about how wearable technology and AI are transforming health, performance, and longevity. From monitoring sleep and recovery to analyzing biomarkers and offering personal health insights, Ahmed shares how Whoop is pushing the boundaries of what’s possible in healthcare in the age of AI. (00:00) Introduction (02:09) What WHOOP measures and how it works (09:20) What new metrics could reveal about the mind and body (15:25) How AI advances are changing WHOOP (18:16) Balancing personalization with privacy (24:00) Measuring health span and longevity (24:37) When performance and health diverge (27:31) The future of preventative, AI-driven health (30:39) The most interesting way Will has used AI Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Neuro-Symbolic AI - with Nicholas Thompson and Ohad Elhelo 15.10.2025 38min

In this episode, Atlantic CEO Nicholas Thompson speaks with Ohad Elhelo, co-founder and CEO of AUI, about neuro-symbolic systems. Apollo-1, AUI's neuro-symbolic foundational model, promises both the fluency of generative models and the reliability of symbolic reasoning, an AI method that uses symbols and explicit rules to represent knowledge and perform logical inference. Could this hybrid architecture finally unlock task-oriented AI at scale? (00:00) Introduction (02:57) A rift in the AI community (04:59) Why neuro-symbolic AI could succeed where chatbots have failed (12:04) How AUI built its model (19:11) How to solve the hallucination problem (25:46) Business use cases for neuro-symbolic AI (30:48) What happens once Apollo One launches (35:03) The most interesting way Ohad has used AI Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Season 3 Trailer 08.10.2025 1min

A podcast series examining how AI is reshaping our world. Each episode features a conversation with a leading thinker who offers a fresh perspective on the far-reaching ethical, economic, and social implications of this technology. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

AI Optimism - with Nicholas Thompson and Kevin Kelly 18.06.2025 37min

What happens if we get AI right? In this episode, Nicholas speaks with Wired co-founder Kevin Kelly about AI’s potential to positively impact the future of humanity. Featured Guest: Kevin Kelly, co-founder of Wired Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Pharma's Future - with Nicholas Thompson, Diogo Rau and Dan Priest 11.06.2025 41min

How is AI shaping the future of healthcare? In this episode, Nicholas speaks with Eli Lilly’s Diogo Rau about how AI is making it easier and faster to find life-saving drugs, and PwC Chief AI Officer Dan Priest about how the technology will transform healthcare experiences for patients in the next decade. Featured Guests: Diogo Rau, Executive Vice President and Chief Information and Digital Officer at Eli Lilly & Dan Priest, Chief AI Officer at PwC Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Making Music With AI - with Nicholas Thompson and Holly Herndon 04.06.2025 36min

AI is transforming the creative landscape, opening up possibilities for a new generation of artists. In this episode, Nicholas speaks with experimental musician and AI artist Holly Herndon about the intersection of human and machine creativity. Featured Guest: Holly Herndon, co-founder of Spawning Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Outsourcing Thought - with Nicholas Thompson and Nita Farahany 28.05.2025 43min

AI is reshaping not just what we think but how we think. In this episode, Nicholas speaks with neuroethicist and legal scholar Nita Farahany about AI's impact on human cognition. Featured Guest: Nita Farahany, Robinson O. Everett Distinguished Professor of Law & Philosophy at Duke University and founding director of the Duke Initiative for Science & Society Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Ethical Machines - with Nicholas Thompson and Audrey Tang 21.05.2025 47min

In the right hands, AI can strengthen human collaboration and civic engagement. In this episode, Nicholas speaks with Taiwanese politician and programmer Audrey Tang about how the technology can be used to enhance democratic structures. Featured Guest: Audrey Tang, Taiwan's Ambassador-at-Large for Cyber Affairs Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices