Two Designers Walk Into a Bar
Evergreen Podcasts
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This podcast looks at pop culture through a design lens. Hosts Todd Coats and Elliot Strunk, two creatively curious friends, explore influential work and the stories behind how the familiar became iconic. The show mixes highbrow and lowbrow, sitting somewhere between grand museums and dive bars. It's part of the Evergreen Podcasts network.
Episode
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Episode 138: Signs of the Times - Barber Poles and Pawn Broker Balls 29.07.2026 47mntWe’re revisiting one of our classic episodes. There are visual icons that have symbolized professions for so long their origin stories are unknown to the very customers served by them. These independent businesses are owned by all kinds of people serving millions on a daily basis throughout the world, all using these same basic signs outside their establishments. We're discussing barber poles and pawnbroker balls, two symbols that, unless you’re truly in the middle of nowhere, you can find within minutes of where you live, work or both. So order up a couple of Barber Beers. We’re lookin' good and feelin' good, back here in the bar. - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Barber Pole Pawn Broker Balls - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-138-signs-of-the-times - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 137: Pop Culture Products - Wonka Bars and Duff Beer 15.07.2026 46mntToday we’re going to use our imaginations a little bit. We’ve brought a couple of interesting products with us to the bar...but not just any products. These two were originally created for movies and television, and later made the leap into the real world once they became household names. We’re having dessert first as we sample a Wonka Bar and then we're wetting our whistles with a couple of Duff Beers. So order up a couple of chocolate martinis. We’re licking our fingers and raising our glasses, back here in the bar. - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Wonka Bar Duff Beer - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-137-pop-culture-products - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 136: KISS, The Bicentennial and the Year 1976 (Classic Episode) 01.07.2026 42mntIn honor of the nation’s 250th birthday, we’re revisiting one of our classic episodes. Why 1976? Plenty of reasons. We discuss each of our ages in this, the banner year our nation was turning 200 and everything in sight had bunting and was painted red, white and blue. KISS was at the height of their powers as Michael Doret’s amazing album art from “Rock and Roll Over” was gracing turntables from coast to coast and the timeless bicentennial star logo from designer Bruce Blackburn was on everything from postage stamps to NASA equipment. And last but not least, Richard Nixon enters the conversation (but not the bar). - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Bicentennial Logo KISS Rock and Roll Over - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-136-1976-classic - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/merch to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 135: Cult Products - TaB Soda and McDonald's Fried Apple Pie 17.06.2026 44mntToday we’re digging around in the backs of our minds and the pits of our stomachs to remember a couple of beloved food products. Ones that have cult followings and large groups of people who lament these products’ eventual demise. We’re talking about the origins of TaB Soda from Coke and the fried Apple Pie from McDonald’s. (Hey, we never said this was a health food podcast…) So ask the bartender to mix a Texas Tab for you – and maybe a couple for us. We’re hitting the drive thru and then rolling back into the bar. - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: TaB Soda McDonald's Fried Apple Pie - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-135-cult-products - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 134: Iconic Pop Culture Cars (Classic Episode) 03.06.2026 47mntWe’re revisiting one of our classic episodes. While we don't recommend drinking and driving, we do recommend talking pop culture and cars while sitting safe and sound on a couple of bar stools. Buckle up as we travel back in time to discuss what are arguably the two most popular cars in pop culture: the original 1960s Batmobile and the DeLorean from Back to the Future. Sometimes they worked, oftentimes they didn't. If you smell some burning rubber, it's not from us thinking—at least not this week. Instead, it's a high-octane topic coupled with some Golden Cadillacs from our bartender. Enjoy. - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: The Original Batmobile The DeLorean DMC-12 - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-134-iconic-pop-culture-cars-classic - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 133: Visual Alphabets - Nautical Flags and American Sign Language 20.05.2026 52mntSigns, signs. Everywhere a sign. Today we’re going to be talking about a couple of colorful visual alphabets. Not typefaces, but the kinds of alphabets that are their own languages. Created to solve specific problems, one works face-to-face and the other from a distance. So give the high sign to the bartender and order up a couple of Ocean Breezes. We’re bringing you the histories of American Sign Language and nautical flags back here in the bar. - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-133-visual-alphabets - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Nautical Flags American Sign Language - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 132: Game Show Logos for The Gong Show and the Dating Game (Classic Episode) 29.04.2026 1j 5mntWe’re revisiting one of our classic episodes. Today we’re going to be talking about game show logos – the good, the bad and the ugly — and how sometimes all of those qualities could be found in a single piece of artwork. We’re zeroing in on a couple that are loud, busy and colorful, just like the era they were created in and the sets they were created for: The Gong Show and Match Game. So grab the remote, ask the bartender for a couple of Slot Machine cocktails and join us once again as we spin the wheel and roll the dice right here in the bar. - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-132-game-show-logos - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: The Gong Show Chuck Barris Match Game Gene Rayburn - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 131: Fabric Patterns and the Stories Behind Camouflage and Paisley 15.04.2026 52mntThere are some new tablecloths here in the bar, which has gotten us thinking about fabric patterns. Today we’re going to be talking about a couple of patterns that, if you don’t personally have them in your wardrobe, you likely know someone who does. We’ve brought in the funky character known as paisley and the shady character known as camouflage. So ask the bartender to mix up a couple of Army & Navies because we’re gonna be having a “wrap session” (get it?) back here in the bar. - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-131-fabric-patterns - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Camouflage Paisley - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 130: Cups, Plates and Trophy Design 01.04.2026 35mntWith March Madness wrapping-up and spring break calling, we’re revisiting one of our classic episodes. If you wander into any school, bar or thrift store, you're bound to see a collection of trophies. Have you ever wondered why they often look like cups, plates and other objects you wouldn't think about grabbing after a robust game of tennis or an intense hockey match? We did, and we’ve got a couple of amazing examples we’re talking about today: Wimbledon's Venus Rosewater Dish for women's tennis and The Stanley Cup for men's hockey. We’re digging into the curious history of why some of the biggest wins come with even stranger hardware. It’s time to grab a couple flutes of champagne to help us toast our latest episode, right here in the bar. - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episode-130-trophy-design-classic - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Wimbledon's Venus Rosewater Dish The Stanley Cup - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 129: Punk Meets Tech and New Wave is Born (Classic) 18.03.2026 40mntWe’re revisiting one of our classic episodes. Bold colors. Funky haircuts. The Cold War and the Cola Wars. Video games and MTV. Japanese electronics and European fashion. Iconic music and movies... If New Wave was a style and attitude, then music was the delivery device. In this episode we discuss the political climate, creative activity and DIY attitudes that led to the formation and rise of one of pop culture’s signature eras. So place your order for a couple of 'Synth Wave cocktails, because we’ve got new haircuts and we're gonna be poppin' and lockin' back here in the bar. - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: “New Wave Graphics Are the Most Influential Designs You’ve Probably Ignored” https://eyeondesign.aiga.org/why-new-wave-graphics-are-the-most-influential-designs-youve-probably-ignored/ “The History and Bands of New Wave Music” https://www.masterclass.com/articles/new-wave-music-guide “Too Fast to Live, Too Young to Die: Punk Graphic Design” and “Reversing Into the Future: New Wave Graphic Design” https://www.emmanuelgallery.org/punk-and-new-wave “My Frame is True: New Wave Posters - in Pictures” https://www.theguardian.com/artanddesign/gallery/2021/oct/02/punk-and-new-wave-posters-reversing-into-the-future-in-pictures Reversing Into the Future, a book from Andrew Krivine https://www.printmag.com/daily-heller/the-daily-heller-and-the-beast-goes-on/ - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-129-punk-meets-tech - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/merch to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon [ https://patreon.com/twodesignerswalkintoabar?utm_medium=unknown&utm_source=join_link&utm_campaign=creatorshare_creator&utm_content=copyLink ] for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 128: Homage Designs - A Poster for Swatch and an Orgy for Disney 04.03.2026 49mntEveryone says that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery. But if that were true, copyright law wouldn’t need to exist. We’re discussing a couple of items that could be called homages…or could be called unfair (or even unauthorized) use (but we’ll leave that up to you): a Swatch poster from the ‘80s and The Disneyland Memorial Orgy from the '60s, two projects with colorful artwork and equally colorful backstories. So place your order for a Rainbow Paradise, because we’re drawing unwanted attention once again here in the bar. - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Paula Scher Swatch The Disneyland Memorial Orgy The Realist Paul Krassner Wally Wood - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-128-homage-designs - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our Merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 127: Psychedelia Comes Down, Hangs Around and Gets Reinvented 18.02.2026 33mntFor one last time, we’re delving into the depths of our expanded minds to talk about the impact of psychedelia on popular culture. We may have been at the bar a bit too long getting our minds…expanded. We have a lot to talk about today as we discuss what happened with psychedelia after The Summer of Love and Woodstock. (Spoiler alert: Nothing like going mainstream to kill a counterculture style.) So help us out by grabbing a couple of Flaming Unicorns as we come back down to earth, right here in the bar. - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Psychedelic Era Psychedelic Fashion John Alcorn Roger Dean McDonald’s TV Commercial Kai’s Power Tools - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-127-psychedelia-part-3 - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 126: The 1960s and the Era of Peak Psychedelia 04.02.2026 33mntIn our last episode we talked about the origins of psychedelia and learned about Bicycle Day celebrated every April. (Hint: it involved a lot of science and experimentation along with maybe a little bit of balance.) Today we dive into the era of peak psychedelia: the mid ‘60s. We talk about the design and music inspired by this—ahem—experimentation and how that informed pop culture for a generation. So, ask the bartender for some Magic Mushroom cocktails and join us as we trip our way back into the bar. - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Psychedelia Human Be-In Wes Wilson Bridget Riley and Victor Vasarely Robert Crumb Rick Griffin Victor Moscoso Alton Kelley Stanley Mouse - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-126-psychedelia-part-2 - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our Merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 125: The Origin Story of Psychedelia 21.01.2026 33mntToday we’re taking a trip through the looking glass. We’re kicking off our series on psychedelia with its origins, the impact on a generation of pop culture and its lasting effects. Psychedelia’s origins are messy, fascinating, and full of odd little historical crosscurrents. We discuss science, bicycle rides and the first official album of psychedelic music. So, ask the bartender for a couple of Psychedelic Frogs—and to see if they can stop the walls from dripping rainbow colors—as we chase the white rabbit through the window and back into the bar. - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Psychedelia Albert Hofmann Aldous Huxley Timothy Leary Ken Kesey The 13th Floor Elevators - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-125-psychedelia-part-1 - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our Merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 124: Talking Food Mascots with Kirk + Kurtts (Classic) 07.01.2026 32mntWe’re revisiting one of our classic episodes. What do Betty Crocker, Charlie Tuna, Tony the Tiger and the oddball characters from Off Limits Cereal have in common? Along with fellow creatives Kirk Visola and Andy Kurtts of the “Kirk and Kurtts” design podcast, they were all our drinking buddies one evening! We chewed the fat with Kirk and Andy about some classic characters and their impact on pop culture (and snacking), and why these same techniques invented decades ago still work today. Order a Bedrock Fizz for yourself (and maybe a few for all of us). It’s time to join four designers back in the bar. - - - - - Watch the full conversation on our YouTube channel and visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Betty Crocker Charlie the Tuna Tony the Tiger Off Limits Cereal Aura Bora Water - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 123: The Origin Story of Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer 24.12.2025 33mntWe have one more Christmas gift for our listeners! Today we’re going to be talking about a holiday icon that began as a marketing stunt. (Let’s be honest. Sometimes it feels like Christmas is just one big marketing stunt.) But we’re with friends, so we're getting into the Christmas spirit. (Or spirits!) Today we’re going to be talking about everyone’s favorite red-nosed reindeer, Rudolph, and his origin story from a retail store’s marketing department to being the guide at the front of Santa’s sleigh. So ask the bartender for a couple of Rudolph’s Tipsy Spritzers because it’s the holiday season back here in the bar. - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-123-rudolph-the-red-nosed-reindeer - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 122: Trailblazing Toys - Hot Wheels Cars and Mego Action Figures 10.12.2025 50mntJust in time for Christmas, we've brought some classic toys with us that have become iconic collectibles. First, we suggest you grab your seat belt and buckle-up as we white knuckle the wheel and talk the fast-paced glitz of Hot Wheels cars, and then we’re gonna fight for truth and justice as we get our hands on some highly collectible Mego superhero action figures. So order up a couple of Caped Crusaders. We’re gonna be crossing the finish line with all of our Super Listeners, right here in the bar. (And just like airline-size liquor bottles, these toys make perfect stocking stuffers.) - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: • Hot Wheels Cars • Mego Action Figures - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-122-trailblazing-toys - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon or subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 121: Giving Thanks for Norman Rockwell’s Four Freedoms 26.11.2025 37mntAs we head into the holiday season, we’re giving thanks by spotlighting the four freedoms—Freedom of Speech, Freedom of Worship, Freedom from Fear and Freedom from Want—along with the man who brought them to life in ways everyone could understand: Norman Rockwell. We talk about how while critics threw shade his way, Rockwell created what is arguably the most iconic Thanksgiving image of all time, parodied and remixed over the years. So mix up a couple of vodka and cranberries and serve them up in a gravy boat. It's time to join us as we give thanks to be with you, our listeners, back here in the bar. - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Norman Rockwell Four Freedoms Freedom From Want - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our Merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 120: Politicians, Superheroes and Stars - Noteworthy Magazine Covers 12.11.2025 56mntMagazines. They’re still big business, but today’s magazines are a pale imitation of what they once were. And being on a magazine cover meant that you hit the big-time. Sometimes that was amazing, other times not so much. Today we’re discussing some iconic covers that made statements from the shelves of newsstands and delivered surprises to unsuspecting mailboxes. John Lennon, Demi Moore, Richard Nixon, New York City, Apple and Batman have all made the cut. So ask your bartender for a round of Boulevardiers and make sure all your subscriptions are up-to-date. We’re bringing a tall stack of reading materials with us to the bar. - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: Wired Vanity Fair The New Yorker Rolling Stone Esquire Life - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-120-noteworthy-magazine-covers - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our Merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices -
Episode 119: Scary Good Posters - The Thing and Creature from the Black Lagoon 29.10.2025 37mntSince it’s still October, we’re continuing with the second of our two Horror Month episodes here in the bar. If you didn’t get enough shock and terror from our last episode, you just weren't listening closely...Come to think of it, that could be said about any of our episodes. Today we’re discussing a couple of amazing horror movie posters for The Thing and Creature from the Black Lagoon. The stories that inspired them, the artists who created them (Reynold Brown and Drew Struzan) and what makes these posters great. So order a round of Black Magic Margaritas for everyone. We’re dimming the lights and lighting some candles back here in the bar. - - - - - Mentioned in this episode: The Thing Creature from the Black Lagoon - - - - - Visit our full episode page for show notes, the visual examples we discuss, additional links and more! https://www.twodesignerswalkintoabar.com/episodes/episode-119-scary-good-posters - - - - - Have a question or idea for Todd and Elliot? Send a note to hello@twodesignerswalkintoabar.com and we promise to read it. After that it’s anyone’s guess. - - - - - Visit our Merch page to have a look at stuff we’ve made for listeners just like you and support us on Patreon for subscriber-only extras. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
