But You Look So Good
But You Look So Good Podcast
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Two psychologists, Sally Shaw and Seona Ilalio, host a podcast that sheds light on the realities of living with chronic health conditions. Both hosts live with chronic conditions themselves and lead Livology, a private practice specializing in psychological support for those navigating chronic health challenges. The podcast features candid conversations and professional insights aimed at fostering community and connection among people with chronic health conditions.
Епизоди
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An Interview with Tessa: Living with Glossopharyngeal Neuralgia 16.07.2026 44минWhat if the doctor tells you there's nothing wrong, but you know that there is? What if you spend two years being dismissed, misdiagnosed, and left without answers, all while living in some of the most excruciating pain imaginable? That's exactly what today's guest, Tessa, experienced when she was eventually diagnosed with glossopharyngeal neuralgia, a rare and devastating nerve condition sometimes known as the suicide disease. Tessa is a psychologist who specialises in chronic illness, eating disorders, and disability, so she brings not only her clinical expertise to this work, but her own profound lived experience as someone navigating multiple invisible and dynamic disabilities. In today's episode, Tessa takes us through her long road to diagnosis, the reality of living with chronic-- the reality of living with constant chronic pain, and what it means to be both the provider and the patient. She shares the tools and boundaries that help her live well, the unique gifts and challenges of working in a space you've personally inhabited, and why finding your howl-at-the-moon person might be one of the most important things that you can do. We hope you enjoy this episode. Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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Can we all Benefit From Creativity, Even if We Are No Good at It? 13.07.2026 46минLiving with a chronic illness can shrink your world. Medical appointments, symptoms, fatigue, and uncertainty can begin to define your days. But creativity offers something illness often takes away: choice, expression, purpose, and joy. In this episode, Sally and Seona explore their own creativity, as well as chat about the science behind art therapy and creative activities, why they improve mental health, and how anyone—regardless of artistic ability or physical limitations—can benefit. Whether you pick up a paintbrush, a crochet hook, or a camera, creativity isn't about producing masterpieces—it's about healing your mind while your hands are busy.
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An Interview with Clara: Being a GP and a patient 09.07.2026 47минToday we're speaking with Clara, a GP from Scotland who was diagnosed with multiple sclerosis in 2014, just months after the birth of her first child.As a doctor, Clara had spent years recognising symptoms in other people. But when those symptoms appeared in her own body, she found every reason to explain them away. In fact, she admits she almost felt like she was humouring her neurologist by agreeing to the tests that would ultimately confirm her diagnosis.In this episode, we explore what happens when medical knowledge collides with denial, why Clara chose to keep her diagnosis private for six years, and how becoming a patient reshaped not only her understanding of healthcare but also the conversations she now has with the people sitting across from her in the consulting room.This is a thoughtful conversation about the complexity of being both the clinician and the patient and the assumptions we make about illness, even when we know better.Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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The Parent Guilt Trap 06.07.2026 41минDoes living with a chronic illness leave you feeling guilty about the kind of parent you are? Whether it's missing school events, cancelling family plans, needing extra rest, or feeling like your children are missing out, parental guilt can be overwhelming. In this episode, we explore why guilt is so common for parents living with chronic health conditions, the difference between guilt and shame, and how unrealistic expectations can keep us feeling like we're never enough. We also discuss what children truly need to thrive, the surprising strengths families can develop through adversity, and practical strategies to let go of perfectionism and build meaningful connection. If you've ever questioned whether you're a "good enough" parent, this compassionate conversation is for you.Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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An Interview with Jacqueline & Alexa: Dating, Disability and Building Dateability 02.07.2026 44минWhat happens when you realise the dating world simply wasn't designed with people like you in mind?After years of navigating chronic illness, more than 40 surgeries, and life with a feeding tube, Jacqueline found that one of her biggest challenges wasn't her health—it was dating. Not because of who she was, but because dating apps weren't built with disabled and chronically ill people in mind.Together with her sister Alexa, she set out to change that by creating Dateability—the world's first dating app designed specifically for the disabled and chronically ill community.In this episode, we talk about dating with a disability, navigating disclosure, relationships, identity, inclusion, and what it's like building a business from lived experience.This is a warm, funny, and refreshingly honest conversation about love, resilience, and creating the kind of world you wish already existed.Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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Managing Menopause with a Chronic Illness 29.06.2026 41минMenopause can be challenging for anyone—but when you're already living with a chronic health condition, it can feel like a whole new layer of symptoms, uncertainty, and frustration. In this episode, we explore the complex relationship between menopause and chronic illness, including why it can be so difficult to tell where one ends and the other begins.We discuss the common overlap of symptoms such as fatigue, brain fog, sleep disturbance, pain, mood changes, and cognitive difficulties, and how these can affect people living with conditions like Multiple Sclerosis, autoimmune diseases, chronic pain, and other long-term health conditions. We also explore the wide variation in menopausal experiences, treatment options including hormone therapy and non-hormonal approaches, and important considerations for bone health, cardiovascular health, mental wellbeing, and quality of life.Whether you're experiencing menopause yourself, supporting someone who is, or working in healthcare, this episode offers practical information, validation, and strategies for navigating this significant life transition with greater confidence and self-compassion.Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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An Interview with Chris: MS, Sport and Rebuilding Identity 25.06.2026 40минToday we're sitting down with Chris Henderson, a man who in 2017 went from playing football in regional Victoria to sitting in a hospital bed being told he had multiple sclerosis, and then being told he'd never play sport again. For someone whose identity was built around sport, that news was devastating. But Chris found his way back to sport and discovered a completely different version of himself, one who plays wheelchair AFL professionally, coaches, captains the Geelong Basketball Club, and has represented Australia internationally. He's also the founder of Freedom Sports, an organisation taking wheelchair sports into schools across Victoria, reaching more than 10,000 students last year alone. But before any of that, there was a time when Chris told almost nobody about his diagnosis, because saying the words out loud made it real, and every time he tried, he cried. This is a conversation about identity, grief, masculinity, sport, and vulnerability. We hope you enjoy listening to Chris's storyLivology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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Understanding Your Nervous System: Flight, Fight, Freeze and Fawn 22.06.2026 35минLiving with a chronic health condition can feel like you're constantly fighting your own body. But what if many of the challenges you experience—fatigue, pain, brain fog, anxiety, overwhelm, poor sleep, and even burnout—are connected to the way your nervous system is responding to ongoing stress and illness?In this episode, Seona and Sally explore the nervous system in simple, practical terms and discuss how understanding it can help people living with chronic illness respond to their symptoms with greater compassion, flexibility, and confidence.Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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Anne’s Voice: The invisible work of Type 1 Diabetes 18.06.2026 28минWelcome to Anne's Story.Today, you'll be hearing Anne Freeman's voice and story.Anne was 21 years old when she was diagnosed with Type 1 Diabetes. What followed was not only the challenge of learning to manage a lifelong condition, but also the emotional and psychological impact of adapting to a future she had never imagined for herself.In this Voices story, Anne reflects on the realities of living with a condition that never takes a day off. She speaks candidly about diagnosis, identity, motherhood, resilience, and the invisible work that goes into managing Type 1 Diabetes every single day.As with all Voices stories, this is an opportunity to hear directly from someone living the experience—because behind every diagnosis is a person, a life, and a story worth hearing.We are incredibly grateful to Anne for sharing hers.This is Anne's Voice.Anne's Instagram - https://www.instagram.com/annefreemanwritesAnne's Website - for books, events, workshops and more - https://www.annefreeman.com.au/Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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Toxic People and Protecting Your Wellbeing 15.06.2026 32минLiving with a chronic health condition means your energy is precious. So what happens when the people around you leave you feeling drained, criticised, guilty, or emotionally exhausted? In this episode, psychologists Dr Sally Shaw and Seona Ilalio explore the impact of toxic relationships on our mental and physical health. From friends and family members to health professionals, they discuss how to recognise unhealthy relationship patterns, the questions to ask yourself when assessing a relationship, and practical strategies for setting boundaries and protecting your wellbeing. You'll learn how to identify the people who support your health, limit exposure to those who don't, and give yourself permission to prioritise your own needs. Because sometimes self-care means carefully choosing who gets access to your energy.Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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An Interview with Lucy: Ehlers Danlos Syndrome 11.06.2026 43минMeet Lucy, a research psychologist from the UK living with Ehlers-Danlos syndrome (EDS), chronic migraine, and persistent pain that went undiagnosed for more than two decades.From painful periods and joint pain to migraines, digestive issues, and fatigue, Lucy spent years collecting diagnoses without anyone connecting the dots. Receiving an EDS diagnosis finally brought answers—but also a profound shift in how she understood herself and her future.In this thoughtful and honest conversation, Lucy shares what it means to live with chronic illness while building a meaningful life. We discuss grief, acceptance, pacing, the constant "pain noise" of living in an unpredictable body, and the deliberate choices she makes to prioritise what matters most.This is a powerful conversation about resilience, self-compassion, and learning to live well alongside chronic illness.We hope you enjoy.
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"Less Than" 08.06.2026 35минOne of the most painful experiences many people living with chronic illness, disability, mental health challenges, neurodivergence, grief, or major life setbacks experience is the feeling of being somehow "less than."Less successful.Less productive.Less capable.Less independent.Less worthy.In this episode, we unpack where this feeling comes from, why it is so common, and how much of it is shaped by the messages we absorb from society rather than objective truth.We'll explore the hidden rules many of us have been taught about worth, success, independence, productivity, relationships, and achievement, and what happens when illness, disability, or life circumstances make those rules impossible to follow.Most importantly, we'll discuss how to challenge these beliefs and begin building a sense of worth that isn't dependent on what we can produce, achieve, or contribute.
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An interview with Becky: MS, Single & Social Media 04.06.2026 40минToday on But You Look So Good, we're sitting down with Becky, a woman who has spent her entire adult life single, and along the way, received a life-changing diagnosis of multiple sclerosis. While Becky has a close and supportive network of family and friends, living with a chronic health condition has meant facing many of life's biggest challenges independently. From managing symptoms and medical appointments, to buying a home on her own and making decisions about the future. There-- These are the realities that come with carrying so much responsibility yourself. But this isn't just a conversation about the hard parts. What began as Becky sharing snippets of her life online grew into something much bigger. By speaking openly about the realities of being single with MS, she created a community where people feel seen, understood, and less alone. Today, she has a deeply engaged following and continues to have honest conversations about life, health, and hope. In this episode, we explore Becky's diagnosis journey, the experience of living with a chronic health condition while single, the challenges and unexpected gifts that she's encountered along the way, and what she hopes for her future. This is Becky's story, and we think you're going to love it.Becky's Instagram: @singlewithmsLivology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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Putting the Chronic in Chronic Illness: How to cope with knowing it will never get better 01.06.2026 34минIn our 100th episode of But You Look So Good, we reflect on the journey of creating this podcast as two psychologists living with MS — what we’ve learned, what has surprised us, and the incredible community that has formed around honest conversations about chronic illness.We then dive into one of the hardest realities many people face: the difference between acute illness and chronic illness. Society teaches us to expect recovery, but what happens when symptoms don’t go away? How do we psychologically adjust to uncertainty, loss, identity changes, and the grief of realising life may not “go back to normal”?In this episode, we explore the major psychological challenges that emerge in chronic illness and share three practical coping strategies to help people “deal with the chronic” — including acceptance, grief, and building flexible hope.Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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An Interview with Robyn: Turning Crohn’s Disease Into Comedy 28.05.2026 41минToday's guest is Robyn, an award-winning comedian and writer who lives with Crohn's disease, a condition that affects millions of people worldwide, yet remains so often misunderstood, misdiagnosed, and for many, carries a huge amount of shame. Because let's be honest, we're talking about symptoms that people often feel embarrassed to speak about, let alone joke about on stage. But Robyn has found a way to take something deeply personal, messy, frustrating, and at times incredibly isolating, and turn it into something honest, hilarious, and deeply human.Fresh off the Melbourne Comedy Festival, and not a stranger to bringing her experience with Crohn's disease to the stage, Robyn joins us to talk about her diagnosis journey, navigating the medical system with a chronic illness, the reality of living with a body that doesn't always cooperate, and how she went from feeling embarrassed by her symptoms to making them part of her art. This is such a funny, real, and important conversation, and exactly the kind of one we love having here. https://www.instagram.com/therobynreynolds/Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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Dynamic disability: when capacity constantly changes 25.05.2026 38минSome days you can function. Some days you can’t. Some days you make plans, show up, laugh, work, parent, and feel almost like yourself. Other days, getting out of bed feels impossible.For many people living with chronic illness or disability, symptoms aren’t static. Capacity can shift hour to hour, day to day, week to week. Pain, fatigue, mobility, cognition, vision, strength, dizziness, function. It can all change. And while that unpredictability can be physically exhausting, the psychological toll is often just as significant.In this episode, we unpack the reality of dynamic disability and fluctuating chronic health conditions, including the anxiety of never knowing what version of your body you’ll wake up in, the fear that a bad flare might become the new normal, and why planning anything can feel incredibly vulnerable when your capacity is unpredictable.We also explore the invisible grief of losing trust in your body, the frustration of being misunderstood because you looked “fine” yesterday, and practical psychological strategies for navigating uncertainty when certainty simply isn’t available.If you’ve ever found yourself asking, Can I commit? What if I cancel? What if this gets worse? What if this never improves? — this episode is for you.Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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An Interview with Fiona: Transplant Recipient, Triathlons, Tenacity 21.05.2026 44минToday you are hearing from Fiona, a woman from Ireland whose life has been shaped by an extraordinary journey through chronic illness, resilience, and reinvention. Fiona was diagnosed with a kidney disease while pregnant in 2009, a diagnosis that came completely out of nowhere. For the next seven years, she managed a progressive debilitating condition while raising three young children, navigating crushing fatigue, a shrinking social circle, and the invisible weight of looking well while feeling anything but. In 2017, thanks to the remarkable generosity of a close friend who turned out to be a near perfect match, Fiona received her first kidney transplant. What followed was a stunning period of renewal. She learnt to swim, took up triathlon, became a qualified triathlon coach, and was on the verge of competing in a half Ironman when her body stopped her in her tracks. By 2024, Fiona's transplant had run its course. She's now on hemodialysis, navigating a second wait for a transplant and doing it, as you'll hear, with honesty, humor, and a hard-won perspective on what it means to live fully inside a body that doesn't always cooperate. This is a conversation about chronic illness, about the friends you lose and the ones who show up, about parenting through pain, about identity and athleticism, and about what happens to your sense of self when your body just keeps changing the rules. Today’s episode is proudly brought to you by Book Dialysis - With a network of 950+ dialysis clinics and hospitals in 60+ countries, you can now easily and safely book your treatment, anywhere in the world. www.bookdialysis.com Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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“Stop Using Your Condition as an Excuse” (and Other Helpful Judgements) 18.05.2026 36минWhat happens when the hardest part of living with a chronic illness isn’t just the symptoms — but the judgement?In this episode of But You Look So Good, Sally and Seona unpack the comments so many people with chronic health conditions hear: “It’s all in your head,” “Maybe if you exercised more,” “You’re a hypochondriac,” and “Stop using your condition as an excuse.”They explore the psychological impact of disbelief, invalidation and gaslighting, and why these comments can create shame, self-doubt and burnout. Drawing from both professional and lived experience, they discuss practical strategies for protecting your mental health, setting boundaries, and learning to trust yourself again — even when others don’t understand your reality.Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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An Interview with Chris: From Nurse to Crime Writer After a 19-Year Diagnosis Journey 14.05.2026 44минOur guest today is Chris, a former nurse of thirty-one years and now an award-winning crime writer who was diagnosed with multiple sclerosis after what he describes as a torturous nineteen-year journey to answers. In this conversation, Chris takes us back to those first strange symptoms, the years of pushing through, continuing to work in healthcare, and the frustration of navigating a medical system that didn't always have the answers or believe what he was telling them. Having spent decades as a nurse, Chris knew the healthcare system from the inside. Experiencing it as a patient was something else entirely. We also explore the pivot his life took from nursing into writing and how his lived experience of chronic illness found its way into crime fiction in a way few stories do. This is a thoughtful conversation about delayed diagnosis, identity, frustration, adapting to life with MS, and building a completely different chapter than the one you expected. LinksLivology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)If you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcastMore about ChrisInstagramBook: Sick to Death
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Anxiety and Chronic Illness 11.05.2026 37минAnxiety can feel very different when you live with a chronic illness. When your body has become unpredictable, your nervous system can begin to stay on high alert — scanning for symptoms, preparing for worst-case scenarios, and struggling to fully relax.In this episode, we explore the relationship between chronic illness and anxiety through a psychological lens. We discuss hypervigilance, uncertainty, medical trauma, health anxiety, and why anxiety often makes sense in the context of living with an unpredictable body. We also share practical and compassionate strategies to help manage anxiety without minimising the very real experiences that can drive it.Links Livology (Psychology - Private Practice)MS: Get Your Head Around It! (Online Course)But You’ll Be OK (Online Course)Webinars and ResourcesIf you need any support after listening to our podcast, you can contact Lifeline in Australia at 13 11 14, available 24/7. For support in other locations, please visit Befrienders Worldwide.Instagram @butyoulooksogoodpodcast
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