Unsung Podcast

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• IN SESSION: An Interview with the Lord of the Logos, Christophe Szpajdel 15.06.2026 1ч 10мин

  You might think you don't know Christophe Szpajdel's work. You almost certainly do. The Emperor logo. The Metallica Mankind clip. The Rihanna lettering that went a hundred feet high at the MTV VMAs. If you've spent any time near heavy music, his hand has been on things you've stared at without knowing his name.This week we sit down with the man known as Lord of the Logos — Belgian-born, Devon-based, currently on shift at the Co-op — to talk about a career that has produced somewhere between 10,000 and 15,000 logos, and counting. We get into his early years doodling in school notebooks in Liège, the Art Nouveau obsession that underpins everything, and how a chance encounter on the Tube ended with his work displayed at one of the biggest awards shows on the planet for £500 — a fee he only learned was for Rihanna after he'd already quoted it.We cover the Emperor logo that defined his reputation, the Metallica commission that required him to draw at Heathrow five hours before a flight to Japan, and the Foo Fighters Christmas jumper that was a mutilation of his work, and what he did about it. We also discuss the readability question that divides the scene, the three-month creative block triggered by a South Korean band, his forestry degree and why nature sits at the centre of everything he makes, and the political stance on Ukraine that has cost him ten logos in one go.The question running through all of it: how does someone this prolific stay original?Highlights 00:00 Intro 01:00 Meet Christophe Szpajdel — Lord of the Logos 04:00 Logo Count and the Goal of 20,000 by 2030 06:00 The Process Explained 09:00 The Unsung Logo and Chris's Tattoo 10:00 Background: Belgium, Poland, Ukraine, Devon 11:00 The Co-op Day Job and Why It Works 13:00 Side Projects: Murals and the Polish Calendar 17:00 Musical Influences: Kiss, Motörhead, Celtic Frost 19:00 First Logos and Early Career 21:00 The Emperor Logo 25:00 Chilean Influence: Rick Zuniga 26:00 Nature, Art Nouveau, and the Forestry Degree 28:00 Best Work Comes from Anger or Obsession with Death 29:00 Symmetry, Creative Block, and the Client Problem 33:00 Live: Working Through the Drag Logo 38:00 The Readability Debate 43:00 The Rihanna Story 47:00 Metallica at Heathrow 53:00 The Foo Fighters Bootleg Response 54:00 The Mandy Soundtrack 57:00 AI and Market Saturation 59:00 Ukraine, Politics, and the Russian Flatmate 01:02:00 Losing Ten Logos Over a Political Stance 01:03:00 Black Metal, Church Burnings, and Forbidden Fruit 01:08:00 The Trump/Putin Artwork 01:09:00 The Books: Lord of the Logos, Archaic Modernism, Oracles in Black
• Are Cabaret Voltaire Britain's Most Pioneering Electronic Act? (Side B) with P6 from Stretchheads, Desalvo and OMO 01.06.2026 2ч 10мин

  In our previous episode, we went deep into the history of Cabaret Voltaire and their importance to UK industrial and, latterly, dance music. Now, we follow the trail we laid therein by taking a journey through the band's extensive discography, really fleshing out how they went from a Sheffield attic in 1973 to a Patagonian field site recording lizards for David Attenborough. Along the way, we take in televangelists, voodoo, Charles Manson samples, Velvet Underground covers, a near-miss with Todd Terry, and a Taylor Swift pressing-plant mix-up that turned a forgotten ambient track into a viral curiosity decades later.Phil Eaglesham (aka P6 - ex-Stretchheads and De Salvo, current OMO frontman) returns to bestow upon us his encyclopaedic knowledge of the band and British industrial music. We start in 1974 with the lo-fi bedroom experiments of Cabaret Voltaire 1974–76, work through the rough-edged early Rough Trade EPs, the spring-reverb wilderness of Three Mantras and Voice of America, the cult monument that is Red Mecca, and the band's stylistic pivots through Hai!, 2x45, The Crackdown, Micro-Phonies, The Covenant, the Sword and the Arm of the Lord, Code, and beyond. We also pick at the more controversial late chapters, including the major-label years, the slightly-too-late acid house pivot, and Richard H. Kirk's solo reactivation of the name.Along the way, we explore the band as a video production company that happened to make music; their roles as curators and tastemakers via Double Vision; the Burroughs-and-televangelism worldview that made them frighteningly prescient about Reagan-era Christian nationalism; and their unsung debt to Black American music and dub. Chris also offers a wider reflection on what it means to lose the egoless purity of your earliest creative work as ambition and industry pressures take hold.We get deep in the weeds talking about the producers they worked with (Flood, Adrian Sherwood, John Robie, Marshall Jefferson); the labels (Rough Trade, Some Bizzare, Virgin, EMI, Mute); their collaborators and contemporaries (DAF, Wire, Throbbing Gristle, Clock DVA, Soft Cell, New Order, The Shamen); and the bands that lifted from them wholesale (Nine Inch Nails, Ministry, The Rapture, White Zombie, and a generation of Glasgow acts you've heard but can't quite place).It all culminates in us taking a closer look at Eight Crepuscule Tracks, a record that Phil thinks is their best and a very pure statement of what the band can and did achieve. We also settle upon what is perhaps the most important lesson to be gleaned from the Cabs' music: the importance of never compromising on your vision. By entering the belly of the beast and somehow remaining intact, they became one of the rare bands in this corner of music history whom nobody has a bad word for.Highlights00:00 Intro01:18 Welcome Back, Phil02:46 1974–76: Egoless Experimentation04:51 Bedroom Records06:30 Extended Play and DAF07:37 The Velvet Underground Cover08:26 Nag Nag Nag10:20 Van With a PA11:38 Three Mantras12:24 Mix-Up14:50 William Burroughs16:48 Voice of America19:35 Peter Care and Double Vision21:41 Red Mecca24:25 Encyclopaedia Bands27:36 Hai!29:36 2x45 in New York32:07 Sheffield's Family Tree32:55 Chris Watson Leaves36:16 The Crackdown42:23 Micro-Phonies46:38 Covenant, Sword and Arm of the Lord49:48 Drinking Gasoline51:45 Code54:58 Listen Up and Reissues57:12 Groovy, Laidback and Nasty1:00:15 Body and Soul1:03:56 Shadow of Fear1:04:51 The Taylor Swift Accident1:08:27 Richard Kirk's Death1:14:50 Bus Shelter Bashes1:19:58 Sincerity vs Seriousness1:25:00 Debt to Black Music1:29:00 Eight Crepuscule Tracks1:51:00 Why Everyone Loves Cab Vol1:58:36 Coming Soon: Coil?!
• Are Cabaret Voltaire Britain's Most Pioneering Electronic Act? (Side A) with P6 from Stretchheads, Desalvo and OMO 18.05.2026 57мин

  Cabaret Voltaire are no one thing. Depending on which corner of the internet you found us from, you might know them as the caustic Sheffield noise act who preceded post-punk, the sinister electro-industrial outfit with a penchant for evangelical samples and anti-fascist agitprop, or the dancefloor-adjacent act who fetched up on Factory's Belgian satellite label and made something close to club music. You're all correct.This week, we have a guide. Phil Eaglesham — P6, former front person of Stretchheads and De Salvo, current singer in OMO, musical walking tour operator, man of broad and alarming musical learnings — is here to help us navigate one of the most complex and wilfully uncommercial bands to come out of the UK, via their transitional compilation Eight Crepuscule Tracks.We trace the band's origins in a Sheffield attic in 1973, chart their debts to dub, Black American music, and the sci-fi soundscapes that shaped a generation of working-class ears, and make the case that Cabaret Voltaire — despite their apparent difficulty — were one of the most industrious and fundamentally political bands of their era. We also get into their time at Western Works Studio, which functioned less like a recording facility and more like the gravitational centre of an entire Sheffield scene; their complicated relationship with Rough Trade; and their connections to Joy Division, Lydia Lunch, Clock DVA, and the bands that would become the Human League and ABC.Along the way, Phil brings original artefacts including a signed 1979 TG/Cab Vol/Rema Rema poster from Tottenham Court Road, and the original 12-inches the album is built from. We also ask what would have happened to Cabaret Voltaire without punk — and conclude they'd likely have ended up an academic footnote rather than a foundational text. Highlights: 00:00 Intro03:56 Meet Phil Eaglesham07:47 P6 — The Name and the Character09:29 Queer Identity in the Industrial Scene12:55 Pseudonyms and Rockism17:44 Cabaret Voltaire: The Basics22:32 Sheffield, Western Works, and the Scene25:18 Rough Trade, The Fall, and Being Prolific29:10 Working-Class Roots and Industrial Culture32:33 Sci-Fi Soundscapes and Electronic Prehistory35:11 Musique Concrète to Cab Vol: How Close Were They?36:13 Dadaism, Situationism, and Confrontational Art38:40 Punk's Effect on Audiences (Not Just Music)40:11 The Counterfactual: Cab Vol Without Punk41:43 Black Music, Funk, and the DNA Nobody Talks About43:39 New Wave, No Wave, and New York Connections46:29 Factory Records, Crépuscule, and the Belgian Connection47:49 Original Artefacts: Posters, 12-Inches, and History50:31 Why Eight Crepuscule Tracks?52:54 Looking Towards Next Week and Outro
• Did Hollywood Kill Jóhann Jóhannsson? 04.05.2026 1ч 22мин

  We don't often cover classical or neoclassical music, as it’s a wee bit out of our wheelhouse. But that doesn’t mean we don’t enjoy it—often, our entry into that world is via film soundtracks. Jóhann Jóhannsson is a perfect example, having scored some of the most iconic films of the last 20 years.However, that’s only part of the story. Jóhannsson also released a series of acclaimed solo records; this week, we’re focusing almost exclusively on that solo output, while also providing an account of his life, his key cinematic works, and his tragic passing in 2018.We chart his path from early days in indie bands to the cross-genre think tank Kitchen Motors, and his meteoric rise as a composer for films like Prisoners, Sicario, Arrival, and The Theory of Everything (for which he won a Golden Globe and earned an Oscar nomination). From there, we take a closer look at his solo discography, including IBM 1401: A User’s Manual (built from his father’s vintage computer recordings), Fordlandia, and the short-film soundtrack And in the Endless Pause There Came the Sound of Bees, as well as posthumous releases like Gold Dust.We cap things off with a discussion regarding his death and the question of whether the pressures of Hollywood played a role in his demise, before focusing exclusively on his 2016 masterpiece, Orphée.00:00 Intro03:56 Meet Jóhann Jóhannsson07:47 Early Life And Indie Bands09:29 Labels And Influences12:55 Chris' Hildur Guðnadóttir Facebook Scam Story17:44 Solo Albums Breakdown22:32 IBM 1401 Masterpiece25:18 Fordlandia And Later Works29:10 Film Breakthrough And Awards32:33 Blade Runner Score Rejected35:11 Blade Runner Score Shakeup36:13 Zimmer Versus Vangelis38:40 Jóhann Interview Clues40:11 Who Made The Call41:43 mother! And The Scrapped Soundtrack43:39 Experimental Sound Design46:29 Final Projects And Legacy47:49 Last And First Men50:31 Posthumous Releases52:54 Death And Tributes55:39 Did Hollywood Kill Him58:48 Orphée Album Deep Dive01:08:32 Why His Music Matters
• Rock and Roll Killing Machine by Drowningman 20.04.2026 1ч 18мин

  This week, we're talking about two things we think are quite interesting. First off, we chat about the early mathcore/metalcore band Drowningman and reflect on why they never quite reached the heights of their peers, such as Converge and The Dillinger Escape Plan—bands they often found themselves touring with in the late 90s and early 00s.While that story is compelling in itself, Drowningman can also count themselves among the artists who tried to sabotage a contractual obligation to a record label. As the story goes, they hit the studio with Kurt Ballou (Converge, God City Studios) to record a very weird album, tentatively titled Best Album Ever. The record was never officially released; it was allegedly created with the sole intention of being purposefully bad in order to satisfy, and terminate, their two-album contract with Revelation Records. In the end it never saw the light of day.This got us thinking about other artists who have tried to escape their contractual obligations. We use this lens to take a wee sojourn into the annals of music history, unearthing stories of several big-name artists who tried, and sometimes succeeded, in doing something similar.We hope you enjoy! Highlights:00:00 Intro01:27 Skipping the Discourse01:56 Viral Bands Debate02:59 Patreon Pitch05:37 Awkward Party Exits06:17 Meet Drowningman08:19 Origins and Scene12:00 Early Releases Breakdown16:07 Rock and Roll Killing Machine Era21:07 Later Records and Fadeout24:47 Did They Deserve Bigger27:05 Contractual Obligation Albums35:38 Ozzy Contract Loophole36:25 Speak of the Devil Drama38:05 Ozzy Album Aftermath38:57 Neil Young vs Geffen39:49 Beach Boys Owed Album40:55 More Contract Escapes42:40 Sisters of Mercy SSV45:46 More Obligation Oddities47:43 Rolling Stones Provocation50:31 Zappa Lather Bootleg51:25 Prince vs Warner Saga57:42 Drowning Man Review59:32 Track Highlights Breakdown01:02:56 Final Verdict and Wrap01:06:21 Outro and Thanks
• The Band That Made One Album About the End of the World (Then Disappeared) 31.03.2026 1ч 13мин

  You may be shocked to hear that Lift to Experience made one album. One. A ninety-minute double CD concept record about the apocalypse, set entirely in Texas, written by three boys from Pentecostal and Baptist backgrounds who genuinely believed they had something to say to God. And then, more or less, they vanished.In this episode we cover the Texas Jerusalem Crossroads in full — the vision behind it, the religious fervour that powered it, and the question of whether you need to share any of that fervour to find the record genuinely moving. We'd argue you don't, and the band themselves seemed fairly relaxed about that.We also get into the wider story, which turns out to be just as compelling as the music. The album that couldn't be bought in its home country for years. The label that mixed it without the band present and broke their hearts. The tour that never happened. The beard competition. The sandwich grill.Along the way we ask a question that feels increasingly relevant right now — what does it actually mean when Americans start singing about Texas as the site of the final battle between good and evil? In 2001 it seemed like a grand artistic conceit. In 2025 it feels a little different.Is the Texas Jerusalem Crossroads the unsung post rock record with actual things to say? We think so. But it's a ninety-minute album, so you've got time to make up your own mind.Highlights:00:00 Intro and Whether We’re Actually Living in the End Times03:11 Album Introduction04:46 Millennium Anxiety09:17 Band Origins11:19 Sound and Influences12:22 Post Rock With Vocals?!17:33 Name and Release19:48 Religion and Meaning25:46 Art Versus Belief29:46 Lyrics and Apocalypse32:00 Track Highlights33:51 Shoegaze Favourite Track34:50 Dynamics of Cloud Nine36:27 Maximalist Texas Vibes37:03 Album Art Joke Explained38:56 Religion and Tech Rants40:53 UK Success US Absence44:22 Recording Struggles and SXSW Myth49:19 Bad Mix and Band Fallout53:17 Aftermath and Cult Legacy56:02 Reunion and 2017 Reissue59:41 Remix Reviews and Changes01:02:42 Apocalypse Talk and Final Thoughts01:07:45 Outro
• When Artists Aren't What They Seem - Ghost Bath Musical Catfishing and Hoax Bands - 380 16.03.2026 1ч 8мин

  You may be shocked to hear that musicians sometimes lie about who they are. Some may say this is not shocking at all - it's almost a tradition. But there's a meaningful difference between Ziggy Stardust and a band from North Dakota claiming to be a Chinese black metal act to game the press.In this episode we try to map that difference. We spend a healthy portion of time on what we're not talking about - aliases, concept bands, anonymity for anonymity's sake - before getting into the genuinely murky territory of bands that have used fabricated identities for commercial advantage. We cover the fake Zombies that toured America simultaneously in 1969, The Masked Marauders and the elaborate Rolling Stone prank that accidentally became a real album, Silibil n Brains, Dundee rappers who got signed to Island Records on the strength of their American accents, before discussing Ghost Bath, the project that brought this whole phenomenon into focus for us.Along the way we also get into AI-generated music, Milli Vanilli (and why what they did is arguably less dishonest than what plenty of current pop stars do routinely, and a genuinely unresolved case involving a supposedly Iraqi black metal band that may or may not have put its members in real danger.The question running through all of it: does context change how we hear music? And if it does — what does that say about us?Highlights:00:00 Introduction01:24 Catfish and Hoax Bands Explained02:11 Patreon05:10 Famous Death Hoaxes05:42 Mystique Versus Scams09:02 Not Aliases or Roleplay10:43 Anonymity and Masks13:23 Fake Touring Lineups19:03 Concept Bands and Bits24:28 AI Bands and Deception27:54 Outright Music Scams30:13 Milli Vanilli Then and Now30:53 Pop Star Fraud Culture33:39 Mask Marauders Hoax35:20 Orion Elvis Impostor38:50 Platinum Weird Backstory40:25 Syllable American Rap Ruse43:38 Jana Mystery Metal Band46:06 Velvet Cocoon Troll Scam48:36 Ghost Bath Identity Debate54:40 Context and Cultural Relativism58:10 Ghost Bath Fallout and Ethics01:02:53 Outro
• Is Insomniac by Green Day an Unsung Classic? (Side B) w/ Rick Bruce from Coffin Mulch/Moondshine Docs - 379 02.03.2026 1ч 59мин

  You may be shocked to hear that Green Day have a lot of songs. Some may say, in fact, that they have too MANY songs, because there does come a point where they all just blend into on another. In this episode we explore this phenomenon, and it is exclusively (in our view) an issue that plagues the latter half of their career. We cover everything from American Idiot to Saviors, and whilst not all of these albums are afflicted in such a way, it definitely seems to become more prevalent as we more closer to the present era. We also ask a crucial question - is Green Day punk? The answer is probably not quite what you expect, but we do debate the finer points. Suggesting that perhaps they could be Schrodinger's punx... All this leads us to trying to answer the real question - is Insomniac Green Day's unsung classic? Let's find out. Highlights: 00:00 Intro 01:53 Car Album Debate 05:07 Legacy Act Question 09:31 Setting Up American Idiot 10:24 American Idiot Phenomenon 14:22 Stadium Band Status 23:08 Broadway And 21st Century 31:15 Uno, Dos, Tre And Rehab 35:38 Revolution Radio To Father Of All 37:38 Father of All Reappraisal 39:03 Critics vs Short Runtime 39:49 Side Projects and Salty Pretzel 43:18 2020 Output and Pandemic Era 44:18 Saviors and Derivative Sounds 48:42 Compression and Phone Listening 52:49 Is Green Day Punk? 01:00:28 Defining Punk and Yardsticks 01:19:59 Insomniac Context and Backlash 01:21:21 Critics and Rawness 01:22:22 Sales and Fan Backlash 01:24:01 Honest Bridge Album 01:26:28 Opening Tracks and Tone 01:30:29 Singles and Track Picks 01:32:56 Production and Gear Talk 01:39:54 Songwriting and Label Control 01:53:48 Closing Tracks and Verdict 01:59:22 Wrap Up and Goodbyes
• Is Insomniac by Green Day an Unsung Classic? (Side A) - 378 16.02.2026 1ч 20мин

  Could it be done? Is it possible to call anything Green Day have ever released both unsung AND (crucially, because there's a fair bit of 'meh' in their catalogue) good? Well folks, this week and next we're going to do our very best to find out. And we're joined by our good friend Rick Bruce from Coffin Mulch and Moonshine Docks. Our contention? That their fourth album, Insomniac, is an unsung classic. This is all relative of course--in the 90s and 00s they sold bucket loads of records. How many people had copies of their records knocking about in their car footwells before 2010? Probably millions. And it hasn't stopped. They're still pulling down millions of streams per month. Objectively, they are huge. And somewhat less objectively, they're probably the biggest punk band ever, and certainly one of the biggest bands on earth. I mean, Insomniac itself isn't even their lowest selling record. And in this episode, we don't even get to it! It's a two parter after all. No, in this episode we talk about everything from the 1000 Hours EP right up to, and including, Warning. With a brief detour into Pinhead Gunpowder too. We'll tackle Insomniac itself in our next episode--as is our way. Timestamps: 00:00 Introduction 02:08 Green Day at the Super Bowl 04:47 Is It Even Possible for Green Day to be Unsung?! 05:23 Support us on Patreon 06:53 Mark's Album-a-Day Project, Power Pop Rabbit Holes & Mic Banter 08:45 Green Day 101: Origins, Pop-Punk Blueprint & Gilman Street 10:51 Influences Deep Dive: Hüsker Dü, Replacements, Costello, Op Ivy & More 15:21 Which Album Is Unsung? Debating Kerplunk, Nimrod & Insomniac 20:27 Early Timeline: Sweet Children, 1,000 Hours EP & 39/Smooth Era 22:40 Scene Discipline vs Scottish Modesty: Getting Good on Purpose 33:03 Kerplunk Breakthrough, Major-Label Controversy & Setting Up Dookie 35:27 How I First Bought Dookie (and Why It Wasn't a 5/5 Yet) 37:03 1994: The Year Pop-Punk Exploded (Offspring, NOFX, Weezer & More) 38:04 Green Day's Mainstream Breakthrough: MTV, Grammys, and the Blink-182 Ripple Effect 43:56 Insomniac (1995): Darker, Faster, Burnout After Fame 46:55 Nimrod (1997): 'Good Riddance' and the Genre-Hopping Era 51:38 Seeing Green Day Live: Glasgow Shows, Merch Regrets, and Peak Memories 53:17 Do Novelty Songs Ruin Pop-Punk? The Big Debate (Descendents, The Offspring, Blink) 59:50 Warning (2000): Polished Pivot, Chasing Hits—or Underrated Growth? 01:09:12 From Warning to American Idiot: The Stolen 'Cigarettes & Valentines' Sessions 01:12:12 On the Cusp of American Idiot (Wrap-Up & Next Part Tease)
• The Life and Times of Charles Bradley - 377 03.11.2025 58мин

  Charles Bradley’s cover of Black Sabbath’s Changes is one that both hosts of this podcast believe could well be the definitive version of the song. And we say that having done three episodes on Black Sabbath — an odyssey that gave us both a newfound appreciation for one of, if not the, most important metal bands to have ever existed. Changes itself is a great song, but this emotional reworking casts an entirely new light on its meaning and power. That, in turn, led us to dive into the work — and world — of Charles Bradley. Much was (rightly) made of Bradley when the then 62-year-old “Screaming Eagle of Soul” burst into public consciousness in 2011 with his debut album No Time for Dreaming. He was met with widespread critical acclaim, and the record proved a major success for his label, Daptone Records. From there, he went from strength to strength, releasing two more albums before his untimely death in 2016 from stomach cancer. A former James Brown impersonator, Bradley’s life was one of tremendous hardship, which ultimately saw him achieve his greatest dream. He burned brightly and briefly, and his final record, Changes — named after the excellent Sabbath cover nestled within — is a remarkable work to bow out with. In this episode, we talk all about his life, through the lens of the 2011 documentary Charles Bradley: Soul of America, before discussing some of our favourite soul covers of rock songs. If you enjoyed this episode, do take some time to check out our Patreon, where you can get early access to episode (with no ads), bonus content and much more.
• The Dark Side of David Bowie and 1970s Groupie Culture - 376 13.10.2025 1ч 19мин

  Bowie fans have long found ways to make peace with some of the more unsavoury aspects of his character and behaviour during that decade. His Thin White Duke persona highlights what, by his own admission, were “the darkest days” of his life. And while he was quick to distance himself from that character as he grew older, its influence on certain members of the British far right certainly left a mark. Yet there is a much darker period of his life than this. It is now a matter of record that he was in sexual relationships with both Lori Maddox and Sable Starr — perhaps the two most infamous “baby groupies” of the early ’70s — when they were just 13 and 15 years old, respectively. Grim stuff all round. We’ll be exploring both of these aspects of his life in this week’s episode, as well as the wider “baby groupie” culture of the era. This episode raises questions about separating the art from the artist, the role of 1970s rock culture, and the personal responsibility of fans. Join us as we navigate the challenging waters of moral grandstanding and personal hypocrisy, questioning if, and how, we can reconcile admiration for Bowie’s art with the transgressions of the man himself. Highlights 00:00 Introduction 00:38 Unfinished Business with David Bowie 02:26 Trigger Warnings 04:05 David Bowie's Complex Legacy 13:57 Fascism and Controversial Statements 38:50 Sexual Misdeeds and Allegations 41:05 Introduction to Statutory Rape in Rock Culture 41:30 The Story of Dana Gillespie and David Bowie 42:34 Lori Maddox and the Baby Groupies 43:29 Sable Starr and the Rock Scene 45:05 The Culture of Underage Groupies 47:24 Laurie Maddox's Relationship with David Bowie 56:51 Jimmy Page and Laurie Maddox 01:00:06 The Wider Problem in Rock Culture 01:07:45 Modern Reflections on Past Actions 01:14:58 Conclusion and Final Thoughts
• Is The Warrior by Scandal a True Unsung Classic? - 375 29.09.2025 57мин

  We're back after a fairly shambolic three weeks in our lives (redundancy sure does suck) with this slice of fried gold from the 1980s. You've almost certainly heard the lead single from this record. In fact, the question as to who the singer is of the song "The Warrior" has quite likely come up on a pub quiz at some point, and you've quite likely got the answer wrong. The answer is not, as you may think, Pat Benetar. It's Patty Smyth. The single this album is named after was an 80s hit, and penned by the legendary Holly Knight. We won't go into a huge amount of detail on her here, but suffice to say we think she's criminally underrated given some of the ginormous tunes she penned in the 80s. Indeed, we cover that in extensive detail in our episode on her short-lived band Device. Scandal imploded soon after this record was released, and members of the band, Patty included, went on to have varying degrees of success in the late 80s and early 90s. Patty Smyth's story itself is a fascinating one, so fascinating in fact that we actually forgot to talk all about her marriage to Television's Richard Hell. That one glaring omission aside, we do a pretty deep dive into Scandal and her career afterwards. HIGHLIGHTS: 00:00 Introduction and Pub Quiz Banter 00:35 Scandal and Patty Smyth: The Early Days 01:22 The Warrior and MTV Success 03:29 Classic Bands and Radio Challenges 05:03 Band Dynamics and Touring 07:24 Patty Smyth's Solo Career and Label Issues 18:31 Declining Van Halen and Family Priorities 21:19 Reunions and Later Years 27:12 Unreleased Tracks and MTV Hits 27:25 Goodbye to You and Other Hits 28:46 Fun Facts and Jimmy Fallon Appearance 29:39 Brian Adams Cover and Other Tracks 31:53 Christmas Album and Charity Work 33:22 The Warrior Album Review 34:44 Songwriting and Collaborations 38:40 The Warrior Music Video 43:12 Journey Song and Album Critique 45:10 Legacy and Final Thoughts
• The Spotify Techsodus - Should Artists Really Be Leaving the World's Biggest Streaming Platform? - 374 08.09.2025 1ч 11мин

  This week we're diving into why bands like Godspeed You! Black Emperor and King Gizzard are pulling their music from Spotify - and why it probably won't change anything. It's a trickier situation than it seems, but the whole mess starts with Napster in 1999. 80 million people sharing MP3s illegally crashed the music industry, dropping revenue 15% in four years and creating a chain reaction that led to piracy running rampant for much of the 00s. Enter Daniel Ek in 2006 with Spotify, which was built initially using pirated music from The Pirate Bay, telling you everything about how much they value artists. But it worked. By offering free access to entire music catalogues (with ads), Spotify created something no competitor can match without hemorrhaging money. Today, 412 million people use Spotify's free tier. That's the foundation of their dominance - not the 263 million paying subscribers. But this creates an impossible situation for artists. Big names with established fanbases can afford to leave, but new artists risk invisibility. Record labels and promoters judge bands by Spotify monthly listeners and post-gig discovery relies on easy music access, meaning that pulling your music from this platform could be potentially damaging for their careers. The "just use Bandcamp" argument misses the point - it's a different business model entirely. Bandcamp is buying a car; Spotify is hiring any car you want. And as it turns out, a LOT of people prefer hiring now. But the real problem isn't Spotify - it's "technofeudalism." Tech platforms operate like medieval fiefdoms where users become trapped serfs. Artists complain about Spotify royalties while creating free content for Instagram and TikTok, which monetise their labour through surveillance capitalism. The arms investment angle (Daniel Ek's €600m in AI weapons) sounds damning until you realise Google runs military AI projects for Israel, Meta builds battlefield AR for the US military, and all big tech props up the military-industrial complex. Their conclusion is bleak: there's no way out. The market expects free music and won't change. Mass boycotts might work but won't happen. The only real solution is direct artist support - gigs, merch, Bandcamp purchases, because it's almost impossible for anyone to truly extricate themselves from terrible machinery of the current internet era. Highlights: 00:00 Introduction: Bands Leaving Spotify 00:15 The Techsodus Idea and Streaming Services 02:23 History of Music Piracy: From Napster to Spotify 07:01 Spotify's Rise and Artist Payments 16:15 Technofeudalism and the Creator Economy 28:34 Spotify's Business Model and Market Dominance 34:58 The Spotify Dilemma: Free Access and Market Expectations 35:15 Apple's Potential and the iTunes Model Revival 35:53 Bandcamp: A Hopeful Alternative? 39:17 The Discoverability Advantage of Streaming Platforms 47:15 The Moral and Practical Dilemma for Artists 59:52 The Broader Issue: Platform Capitalism and Tech Giants 01:15:00 Supporting Artists Directly is The Only Real Solution
• The Mystery of Q Lazzarus - 373 18.08.2025 1ч 4мин

  As stated at numerous points in this episode, a lot of the things discussed here can be found in the documentary Goodbye Horses: The Many Lives of Q Lazzarus. We urge you to go check out that film here: https://vimeo.com/ondemand/qlazzarus as it is a brilliant piece of work. For long time pod fans, this episode could technically be classed as part of our unsong series. But the reality is that the story of Q Lazzarus is so interesting, that it simply bursts out of the constraints of that format. Q Lazzarus/Diane Luckey, is best known for the song "Goodbye Horses", a track that you've almost certainly heard at some point in your life. It's most notable use was in the Jonathan Demme classic Silence of the Lambs, but it has been used in a bunch of films since then, and covered by an array of artists. It is, in fact, that only "official" release by Q Lazzarus. She would later go on to appear in Demme's next film, the wonderful Philadelphia, singing a cover of Roxy Music's classic tune "Heaven". After that, though, she would simply vanish from the industry entirely. So what happened? Why did this seemingly promising up and coming artist, who had two huge brushes with fame, suddenly disappear without trace? Well, it's a rather complicated, and compelling, story that touches on industry discrimination, artist exploitation, and the music business's treatment of unique talents. This week we dive into that story, with the help of a remarkable documentary film called Goodbye Horses: The Many Lives of Q Lazzarus - a film that came about through an almost impossibly serendipitous encounter between filmmaker Eva Aridjis Fuentes and her mysterious subject. The documentary is available on Vimeo and you should absolutely check it out for yourself, alongside the Sacred Bones compilation of her previously unreleased works. Please note that this story deals with some heavy themes and doesn't have the resolution we might hope for, but it's an important and deeply affecting tale that deserves to be told. Highlights: 00:32 Discussing Q Lazarus and 'Goodbye Horses' 02:30 The Mystery Behind Q Lazarus 03:19 Q Lazarus's Musical Journey 05:36 The Impact of 'Goodbye Horses' 07:19 The Search for Q Lazarus 12:01 Eva Aridjis Fuentes and the Documentary 17:58 Q Lazarus's Early Life and Career 30:37 The Duality of Q Lazarus and Diane Luckey 31:36 The Role of Luck in Diane's Life 32:52 Career Setbacks and Personal Struggles 34:00 Heartbreak and Disillusionment 34:57 Descent into Darkness 38:10 A Glimmer of Hope: Motherhood and Redemption 39:47 The Unreleased Works and Legacy 42:12 The Battle for Royalties 44:17 The Impact of Goodbye Horses 53:16 The Unfulfilled Potential and Legacy Tours 57:31 Final Thoughts and Reflections
• Is Hulk Hogan's Entrance Music the Best Wrestling Theme Ever? - 372 04.08.2025 50мин

  Everyone knows Hulk Hogan's entrance music, but how many know the fascinating story behind Rick Derringer's "Real American"? With the recent passing of Hulk Hogan, we thought we’d revisit a previous episode and update it with new information. Oh, and also to film the whole dang thing as we weren’t doing that back then. So, this week we’re exploring the unlikely journey of a song that became one of wrestling's most iconic themes, examining its cultural impact, political appropriation, and the complex legacy of both its creator and, in some ways, Hulk Hogan too. From Rick Derringer's impressive musical pedigree (The McCoys, collaborations with Steely Dan, producing Weird Al) to the song's evolution from US Express theme to Hogan's signature tune, we unpack how a piece of 1980s excess became a cultural touchstone - and political football. We also talk about Rick Derringer's extensive musical career and connections, the origins and evolution of "Real American"; WWE's "Rock and Wrestling Connection" era in the mid to late 80s; the song's political appropriation across decades; Hulk Hogan's controversial legacy and recent passing; the music video's gloriously over-the-top 80s aesthetic and more. Let’s fight for the right of every man. Or everyone, depending on the version you prefer. Episode Highlights 00:00 - Introduction and Hulk Hogan's recent cultural relevance 01:30 - Rick Derringer's impressive musical CV and career highlights 03:00 - The creation story: "The most patriotic song of all time" 05:30 - Wrestling music history and the Rock and Wrestling Connection 12:00 - How "Real American" became Hogan's theme (it wasn't originally!) 15:00 - Hulk Hogan's controversial legacy and recent scandals 18:00 - The Wrestling Album and WWE's musical ambitions 22:30 - The song's political life and cultural appropriation 28:00 - Iron Sheik's legendary Twitter feuds with Hogan 31:40 - Rick Derringer's own political evolution and re-recording 36:30 - The gloriously cheesy music video breakdown 41:00 - Why this song represents the 1980s perfectly 44:00 - Final thoughts on Hogan's impact and the song's enduring legacy
• So What's the Deal With Phil Anselmo? - 371 21.07.2025 1ч 4мин

  Like us, are you somewhat uncomfortable of about Pantera playing with Metallica? Why exactly might that be? We need to explore what it is about Phil Anselmo that gives people that icky feeling. This week we try to put some meat on the bones about the rumours that have dogged Anselmo for the last three decades of his career. White supremacist? Racist? Just a bit of a steamer?  What is it about this guy that has gotten him this reputation? Is it merited? And if it is merited, do we have any sort of obligation to act on that? The Pattern of Behaviour It's an issue that's dogged Phil throughout his career, but came into sharp focus at the conclusion of the Dimebash concert in 2016. The thing is though, focusing too much on that fiasco is that it allows flimsy and bad faith justifications. Too much alcohol is one. "Oh, he was just trolling" is another. They've been fairly successfully passed off as excuses for not just his misdeeds that night, but his behaviour more generally. That smokescreen has enabled millions of paying Pantera fans to handwave away the evidence of their own eyes and ears. Denial is a powerful thing, especially when a band is so intrinsically tied up in the carefully guarded nostalgia of countless nineties teenhoods. Anselmo's history with white supremacist rhetoric and imagery goes back a long way. It's been scattered, downplayed, obfuscated to such an extent that it's easy to lose track. We gather all those details in one place so you can make better informed decisions about where you spend your money and what sort of behaviour we seek to excuse on literally the biggest of the world's stages. Episodes Referenced Our interview with former white supremacist turned anti-extremist advocate Arno Michaelis: https://bleav.com/shows/unsung-podcast/episodes/in-session-12-arno-michaelis-author-anti-extremism-activist-and-former-white-nationalist-side-a-360/ Slayer - South of Heaven: https://bleav.com/shows/unsung-podcast/episodes/episode-203-south-of-heaven-by-slayer/ Highlights 00:00 Introduction and Initial Reactions 00:14 Why Pantera Supporting Metallica Feels Wrong 01:02 Your Money is Your Vote: Consumer Responsibility 01:54 The Pattern Begins: Early Controversial Incidents 03:42 The Dimebash Incident: Sieg Heil on Stage 06:07 A Decades-Long History of Problematic Behaviour 21:03 Confederate Flags: Heritage Not Hate? 25:27 Dog Whistles and Lyrical Controversies 30:32 The Night Everything Changed: Dimebash 2016 31:28 What Actually Happened at the Concert 31:50 Rob Flynn Breaks Ranks 32:55 The Silence Before the Storm 33:57 From 0% to 1000% Apologetic in Three Days 35:15 The Metal Press: Complicit in the Cover-Up? 36:58 Is Metal's "Radical Freedom" Part of the Problem? 38:12 Who Is Phil Anselmo Really? 53:31 Making Informed Choices as Music Consumers Support the Show You can support Unsung via Patreon at www.patreon.com/unsungpod. Join at the lower tier for bonus content, early access, and our closed members group where you can suggest episodes. Or join the record club where you get sent records by independent bands from independent labels.
• The Velvet Sundown: The AI Band Controversy Explained - What Happened and What's Next - 370 14.07.2025 1ч 34мин

  You may have seen the AI band The Velvet Sundown pop up in the news recently and thought "well, that's weird". Long-time fans of the pod probably also thought "when are they going to do an episode on that?" Well, here it is! The Velvet Sundown - What Actually Happened? If you've been following us for a while you'll know that every 18 months or so we seem to return to broader discussions about where music and technology intersect. It began with an episode on Threatin (if you remember who Threatin is, well done) and how one man's quest for fame led to him faking a massive fanbase. A quest that ended with him playing to empty rooms across the UK, and saw him trying to retcon it into some kind of art hoax. Later, we discussed what a possible future using AI music might look like in March 2019, looking at the early attempts to create artificial intelligence music and how the data given to streaming platforms could very well be used to create music. An episode that is now quite prescient in retrospect. Mark was actually quite optimistic that a Velvet Sundown-esque AI band scenario would not come to pass. How naïve... And then in October 2023 we took a two episode deep dive into Spotify playlist manipulation, and how it began way back in the early days of radio with payola. Spotify algorithm manipulation plays a huge role in how the person/entity behind The Velvet Sundown was able to gain so much traction so quickly - reaching 1.1 million plays and potentially earning £35,000+ annually. AI Music - The Bigger Picture This week's episode continues this tradition. We cover some old ground in places (the history of AI music and playlist manipulation), but for the vast majority of the episode we break new ground. We look at the hard numbers around what this synthetic music "artist" stands to make, examine other AI-generated bands like Anna Indiana, The Devil Inside, and Aventhis, ponder both the inventive and interesting uses of artificial intelligence in music as well as the more troubling ones, and look at some possible futures in the wake of all this AI band controversy. You can also watch this episode on YouTube, if that's your thing. Link is here: https://youtu.be/04mYK3G4x5k If you've enjoyed this episode, do consider subscribing to our Patreon at www.patreon.com/unsungpod Highlights: 00:00 Introduction to The Velvet Sundown 00:36 AI in Music: From Skynet to Rei Toei 01:35 The Rise of The Velvet Sundown 03:05 AI Bands and Their Impact 07:33 History of AI in Music 17:18 Modern AI Music Innovations 33:31 The Future of AI in Music 36:10 Financial Implications of AI Bands 42:05 The Impact of AI on Job Replacement 43:43 The Uncanny Valley in AI Music 45:07 Genres and AI's Ability to Mimic Them 49:57 AI's Influence on Modern Music Production 55:21 The Rise of AI in Country Music 59:24 The Future of AI in the Music Industry 01:07:19 Ethical and Regulatory Concerns 01:21:34 Concluding Thoughts on AI in Music
• Why Do US Maple Sound Like That? w/ Ferruccio Quercetti from CUT - 369 07.07.2025 1ч 40мин

  This week we're talking about US Maple. Which is a bit like saying we're talking about having your teeth drilled without anaesthetic. The Chicago quartet spent twelve years making music that deliberately disappointed every expectation you might have about rock music. They took guitars, drums, and vocals and somehow made them sound like they were arguing with each other in a language nobody understood. It was brilliant. It was infuriating. It was absolutely necessary. This is the final part of our Anti Rock trilogy, where we've been exploring bands that knew the rules of rock music inside out and chose to break every single one of them. US Maple didn't just break the rules though. They took the rulebook, fed it through a modified guitar with quarter tone frets, and sang over it like a demented lounge singer having a breakdown. We get into their impossible discography, their custom instruments that were designed to sound worse, their legendary tour with Pavement where they got pelted with rubbish nightly, and that infamous Oklahoma City incident involving Xanax and a cockroach. We also try to answer the eternal question: why would anyone voluntarily listen to this? Fair warning: this episode might make you feel slightly seasick. That's entirely by design. Featuring Ferruccio Quercetti from the brilliant Italian band Cut, who knows more about post punk and experimental music than literally anyone we know. Highlights: 00:00 Introduction and Welcome 00:58 Meet the Hosts and Anti-Rock Series Recap 05:25 Defining Anti-Rock vs. Post-Rock - The Core Question 18:51 Chicago's Noise Rock Scene and US Maple's Origins 20:32 The Band Formation and Todd Riman's Hybrid Guitar 24:00 "Snagglepuss on a Bender" - Early Recording Stories 31:47 The Commitment to Anti-Rock Philosophy 38:00 The Legendary Oklahoma City Incident 44:00 Shorty: The Band That Spawned US Maple 49:00 Album Deep Dive: Long Hair in Three Stages 59:08 Sang Fat Editor and Quarter-Tone Guitar Experiments 01:08:00 Talker and Working with Michael Gira 01:17:00 Purple on Time - The "Mainstream" Album 01:22:13 Al Johnson's Anti-Rock Manifesto 01:24:46 Why US Maple is "Weirdly Soothing" 01:29:00 Mark's Virgin Takeaway on the Band 01:33:54 Conclusion and Farewell
• No Wave: The Nihilistic New York Movement That Influenced 40 Years of Music - 368 30.06.2025 56мин

  This week we're diving headfirst into the gloriously pretentious world of No Wave - the three-year New York art scene that somehow managed to influence everything that followed. Chris has somehow convinced Mark and our resident Italian punk professor Ferro to explore how a bunch of art school dropouts in a financially bankrupt New York accidentally created one of music's most important movements. We start with New York City in 1978: a proper shithole where you'd genuinely risk your life getting a taxi to Brooklyn, Times Square was basically a war zone, and the city had literally gone bankrupt. Perfect conditions, as it turns out, for a load of bohemian kids to move in, pay bugger all rent, and start making the most deliberately difficult music imaginable. Enter Brian Eno, who's meant to be in New York producing Talking Heads like a normal person, but instead wanders into some art space gig and discovers bands like Teenage Jesus and the Jerks, DNA, Mars, and The Contortions doing something completely mental. Being Brian Eno, he obviously decides to document the whole thing, creating the legendary "No New York" compilation that basically put the entire movement on the map. We get properly stuck into the key figures: Lydia Lunch being an absolute force of nature in Teenage Jesus and the Jerks, James Chance slapping music critics (literally - he assaulted Robert Christgau), and the various weirdos who decided that what punk really needed was to be even more antagonistic to its audience. Ferro brings his encyclopaedic knowledge of the European connections, particularly the parallels between New York's urban decay and Berlin's post-war experimental scene. We explore how Einstürzende Neubauten were literally destroying studio floors with sledgehammers whilst Throbbing Gristle were essentially inventing industrial music in their Yorkshire squat. The conversation sprawls magnificently through Swans' absolutely punishing early albums, the way Sonic Youth emerged from this scene, and how bands like Bush Tetras and Rat at Rat R kept the torch burning. We also dive into some proper tangents about Madonna apparently being in an art punk band with future Swans members (mental) and how this whole movement influenced everything from the Load Records noise rock scene to modern post-metal. This is part two of our anti-rock trilogy. Last week we tackled the prehistory from musique concrète to Captain Beefheart, and next week we'll finally get to US Maple and try to explain why anyone would voluntarily subject themselves to their particular brand of musical torture. Highlights 00:00 Introduction to No Wave and Brian Eno's Influence 00:33 Welcome to the Podcast 01:04 Recap of Previous Episode 02:14 The Rise of No Wave in Late 1970s New York 02:46 Sociological Context of 1970s New York 02:59 Key Figures and Bands in No Wave 03:43 The No New York Compilation Album 07:59 Brian Eno's Role and Impact 11:02 Musical Influence and Legacy of No Wave 20:04 James Chance and The Contortions 22:44 Sonic Youth and Swans: Post No Wave Evolution 25:51 The Influence of Swans on Post-Metal 27:25 Exploring Lesser-Known Bands: Rat at Rat R and Bush Tetras 28:48 The Impact of Foetus and Throbbing Gristle 35:13 Berlin's No Wave Movement and Einstürzende Neubauten 41:08 The Legacy of No Wave in Chicago and Beyond 45:03 Anti-Rock Bands and Their Influence 48:38 Concluding Thoughts and Teasers for Next Episode
• Anti-Rock: When Musicians Deliberately Break the Rules w/ Ferruccio Quercetti - 367 23.06.2025 1ч 5мин

  This week we're tackling the wonderfully niche concept of anti-rock. Or more specifically, we're trying to work out what the hell it actually is, why Google doesn't seem to know either, and how it connects to everything from Frank Zappa taking the piss out of The Beatles to bands who are so talented they deliberately make themselves sound rubbish. Chris has dragged poor Mark and our resident punk professor Ferro down a rabbit hole that starts with French composers banging bits of concrete in the 1940s and somehow ends up at US Maple, a band that sounds like they're actively trying to annoy you. Along the way we encounter Captain Beefheart's deliberately mental Trout Mask Replica, The Residents being mysterious weirdos in eyeball masks, and Suicide essentially inventing electronic music with what amounts to a homemade fuzz box. We get properly stuck into the prehistory of experimental music, from Pierre Schaeffer's musique concrète through to the New York art scene of the 1970s. Our main thesis is that anti-rock isn't just noise for the sake of it - it's what happens when genuinely skilled musicians decide to systematically tear apart rock conventions from the inside. Think of it as punk's more cerebral, art school cousin who's read too much Derrida. This is part one of three. Next week we'll tackle the No Wave explosion in late 70s New York, and part three will finally explain why US Maple exist and why anyone would voluntarily listen to them. We also touch on Glenn Branca's guitar symphonies, Pere Ubu's Cleveland weirdness, and try to work out why some of the most influential experimental music came from artists who could absolutely play it straight if they wanted to. Spoiler: they definitely didn't want to. Timestamps: Episode Highlights: 00:00 Introduction and Initial Banter 00:51 Meet the Guest: Ferro (Not Pharaoh) 01:47 Ferro's Musical Journey and PhD in Punk 04:16 What the Hell Is Anti-Rock? 09:37 French Blokes Banging Concrete: The Birth of Musique Concrète 22:01 When Classical Composers Lost Their Minds 27:48 Moondog: The Homeless Viking of Sixth Avenue 28:25 How American Music Got Properly Weird 29:15 Snake Time Rhythms and Native American Influences 30:04 From Experimental Composers to Rock Subversion 30:36 Captain Beefheart's Deliberately Mental Masterpiece 35:05 Red Crayola: Texan Psychedelic Deconstructionists 40:42 The Residents: Eyeball Masks and Musical Terrorism 47:09 Suicide: Two Blokes and a Homemade Fuzz Box 52:06 Pere Ubu: Cleveland's Contribution to Musical Chaos 55:38 Setting Up the No Wave Explosion