Cross Party Lines

Epizódok

• 
  9/11, Campaign Chaos and Rogue Machines 14.09.2026 53p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines marks the 25th anniversary of September 11 with a deeply personal account of the night the world changed — and then turns to an election campaign generating more heat than light and an AI warning that even the people building it are frightened by.All thanks to our foundational partner Frank Risk Management, the 100% Kiwi Owned Insurance Brokerage.To hear more from the Both Sides Now Podcast, use this link.In this episode:* September 11 — where they were, what it meant and the wars that followed — Phil was Foreign Minister when the call came through at one in the morning from his driver: go downstairs and turn on the television. By the time he got there, the second plane had hit the South Tower. Chris had just returned from three months studying Latin in Rome with a drunk monk from Milwaukee. Both share vivid personal accounts of the hours and days that followed.* Campaign week: KiwiSaver, student loans, supermarkets and the same old Peters playbook — Labour’s KiwiSaver policy gets a broadly positive reception — raising employer contributions to six percent over four years, with employee contributions defaulting to four percent but not mandated, addressing the million New Zealanders contributing nothing and losing their employer match. The Greens’ state-owned supermarket proposal gets a more sceptical hearing: Phil’s nuclear option would be forcing Pak’nSave to divest from its parent, bringing real competition rather than a government-owned operator with no track record in retail. National’s transport policing announcement — fifty officers for the CRL — draws a wry Chris story about being abused on the Karori bus and not one passenger helping, and his firm view that police should at minimum patrol that route.* AI — when the people building it start warning you, listen — Phil opens the final segment with what he calls the most serious issue of the episode: AI systems at OpenAI, Anthropic and Meta have been found taking their own initiative, contrary to instruction, in ways their creators did not anticipate. The CEOs of those companies — people Phil is often cynical about — are now issuing serious warnings about existential risk. Chris agrees the only possible response is international, drawing the analogy of the Berne Convention on copyright: domestic legislation alone cannot work when the technology is global and the race to get ahead of competitors is driven by the United States and China.Along the way: the CRL opening attended by five politicians who had nothing to do with getting it built, an Auckland Grammar head girl giving Phil hope for the future, Pauline Hanson attacking Anthony Albanese’s dead mother for living too long in council housing — prompting Chris’s most disgusted response of the podcast.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.📋 Election day is 7 November. Make sure you’re on the roll — and make sure everyone you know is too. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Vacuum in the Pacific and Lies on the Billboards (Live at WORD Christchurch) 07.09.2026 59p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines takes to the stage at The Piano in Christchurch for a sold out live episode that opens with a tribute to the resilience of Cantabrians and closes with a plea to get on the electoral roll before 25 October. In between: the Pacific being carved up by superpowers, an election campaign built on little lies and big lies, and the strategic questions nobody in Wellington wants to answer.All thanks to Frank Risk Management - The 100% Kiwi Owned Insurance Brokerage.In this episode:* The Pacific — neglected, militarised and handed to China on a plate — Phil’s account of the Pacific Island Forum in Palau is forensic and sobering. Five leaders stayed away — all from countries with close Chinese ties — in what Phil reads as geostrategic interference turning a forum for Pacific solidarity into a proxy battleground between Washington and Beijing. The Cook Islands leveraged China against the United States and got $100 million for a port on Penrhyn — an island of a few hundred people with a deep harbour that can take warships. Chris and Phil agree on the diagnosis: for generations New Zealand neglected the islands, failed to build the courthouse in Samoa, paid peanuts in compensation for the Rena, and now wonders why China has filled the vacuum.* Election lies, ACT’s contradictions and promises that will never be kept — Chris invokes what he calls the principle of political attribution: if you’re going to say Labour is responsible for every tax floated by the Greens, Te Pāti Māori and the Opportunities Party, then National must own the BNZ nationalisation, Paul Henry’s $2 billion cancer hospitals and every other coalition promise. Phil is blunter: Simeon Brown’s nine-taxes campaign is an absolute bloody lie, and he says so to a Christchurch audience that appears to agree. The ACT policy to abolish the Māori and Pasifika medical school admissions scheme draws Phil’s sharpest domestic argument of the episode: David Seymour was asked why racial discrimination applies to Māori and Pasifika entry but not to rural students. Both Phil and Chris are scathing about the race to the bottom on tax promises, with Phil noting that two-thirds of New Zealanders say they’d happily pay more tax for a health system they can rely on — and asking why no major party is listening.* The audience takes over — strategic planning, superannuation and the antidote to populism — The Christchurch audience doesn’t hold back. The standout question of the night comes from the floor: how, under a three-year parliamentary term, does New Zealand ever achieve long-term strategic planning on infrastructure, immigration and an ageing population? Phil draws the direct lesson from Auckland’s $200 million wasted on light rail planning — scrapped by an incoming government — and argues that long-term projects need genuine cross-party buy-in from the start. Chris backs a revived Commissioner for the Future, abolished by Muldoon in 1983, as the structural answer. On superannuation, Phil raises the question both major parties refuse to touch: life expectancy has risen ten years since the retirement age was set at 65, he worked until he was 71, and he was still drawing a pension while doing so. On the trade agreements question — a Cantabrian asks why the government is walking back its climate commitments under the EU and UK FTAs. And on populism, Phil and Chris deliver their clearest joint statement of the season: the antidote is not rhetoric, it is major parties performing — delivering for the broader community, not just their own tribe, and being honest about the cost of doing so.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.📋 Not on the electoral roll? Enrol before 25 October or your vote won’t count. Don’t let anyone you know get disenfranchised. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Tax Lies, Perverse Pay Packets and Social Media Meltdowns 31.08.2026 49p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines returns in a week dominated by tax promises nobody can keep, a CEO pay packet that defies all decency and a rare moment of cross-party agreement on social media and children that both men want to see survive the campaign.All thanks to Frank Risk Management - the 100% Kiwi owned insurance brokerage and proudly the foundational partner of Cross Party Lines.In this episode:* The tax debate nobody’s having honestly — National is running a campaign claiming Labour will introduce nine to eleven new taxes. Labour is talking about one: capital gains. But Phil is equally unsparing about his own side — jumping on the bandwagon to promise no fuel excise increase, regardless of the road maintenance bill that creates, is not honest politics either. Chris reaches back to George H.W. Bush’s “read my lips, no new taxes” pledge — delivered in New Orleans in 1988, broken within two years for entirely good economic reasons — as the canonical warning against definitive promises in election campaigns.* $30 million for a CEO while the stock tanks — and what it says about corporate governance — The revelation that a major New Zealand CEO received $30 million in remuneration while the company’s share price was falling prompts one of the more animated exchanges of the episode. Phil draws a direct line between runaway executive pay, the collapse of faith in institutions, and the rise of populism. Chris is equally blunt: a board that approves that package while the stock is declining has failed its most basic governance responsibility.* Social media, children and a rare cross-party moment worth protecting — In the episode’s most substantive segment, Phil and Chris give a thorough and genuinely cross-partisan treatment to the social media age restriction bill. Phil went away and read the expert literature: psychologists documenting compulsive and addictive platform design, decreased attention spans, social isolation, predators and paedophiles operating with industrial efficiency online, and mothers at overseas protests holding photographs of children who took their own lives after being bullied. Australia’s under-16 ban hasn’t been perfectly enforced — 70% of banned children found workarounds — but as Phil argues, an imperfect solution to a real problem is not a reason to do nothing.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎙 Next episode live from Christchurch — Word Festival, 6 September. Sold out, but follow us so you don’t miss the recording. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Hospital Crisis, Dirty Money and Trumps Midterm Nightmare 24.08.2026 51p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines returns to its usual programming for an episode that is almost entirely about the health of democracy itself: in New Zealand’s hospitals, in its political donation system, in its local body elections and in the United States with 74 days to go.Thanks to Frank Risk Management, the 100% Kiwi owned insurance brokerage. Get more info at frankrisk.co.nz.In this episode:* Health, housing and the election’s tier-one issues — Phil opens with a forensic and at times furious account of New Zealand’s hospital emergency departments: patients waiting up to fifty hours for a bed, wards operating at two to three hundred percent capacity, people in acute pain sitting in bright lights unable to sleep. Chris adds property rights as his personal tier-one issue — invoking the OECD Secretary General Matthias Cormann’s argument that the rule of law is the single most important ingredient in a wealthy, functioning economy, and connecting it to the greyhound racing shutdown, the MACA amendment and sixty Treaty settlements he signed.* Cleaning up New Zealand politics — donations, lobbying, ballot theft and postal voting — Phil walks through a list of reforms both men broadly support: a Parliamentary Budget Office (Labour has now officially adopted it as policy, prompting an alleluia from Chris); a lobbyists’ register; a strengthened Official Information Act with real enforcement; and caps on political donations. The $245,000 donated by thoroughbred breeder Peter Feller to New Zealand First — whose leader is the Minister of Racing — and the half-million from Graham Hart to the National Party are held up as symptoms of a system that allows money to buy access in ways that undermine equality.* Trump’s five outrages and the American midterms taking shape — With 74 days until the US election, Phil delivers five rapid-fire outrages: threatening to bomb Oman — an American ally; curtailing military exercises with South Korea to avoid offending Kim Jong-un; doing nothing about Netanyahu rejecting his own peace envoy’s plan; losing his Supreme Court appeal on the E Jean Carroll sexual abuse case; and fleeing a purported Iranian assassination plot via catering van while leaving Marco Rubio and the entire press corps on Air Force One as a decoy — accompanied only by the woman who types his Truth Social posts. Chris notes Iowa — reliably Trump country — is now in play because of soybean tariffs, that Susan Collins is vulnerable in Maine, and that Trump’s approval has dropped from 52% at inauguration to 33% in the Reuters poll. The independents are leaving. The farmers are hurting. And a proper midterm conversation with a guest is being planned.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎟 Christchurch Word Festival — 6 September. Tickets available now at wordchristchurch.co.nz This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Live Q&A: New Zealand's Greatest Mistake, the Foreshore Lie and Who's Worst 17.08.2026 41p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson with special guests Helen Clark and Tracey Martin, this bonus episode brings together the questions from the live Q&A sessions at both the Auckland Q Theatre and Wellington Hannah Playhouse shows.All thanks to Frank Risk Management, the 100% Kiwi owned insurance brokerage.The audience asks, the panel answers:* What was New Zealand’s biggest missed political opportunity? — Phil and Chris are in rare and emphatic agreement: Sir Robert Muldoon winding up the Kirk government’s superannuation scheme in 1975 — for short-term political advantage — is the single most costly decision in New Zealand’s modern history.* Energy, health, the Crown-Māori relationship and urgency in Parliament — The audience covers the waterfront. On energy: all three panellists back pumped hydro over an LNG terminal, and Phil draws a line connecting Malcolm Turnbull’s climate pragmatism to what New Zealand’s current government is getting catastrophically wrong.* AI, trans rights, capital gains tax and the Opportunities Party — The rapid-fire second half covers the issues the audience most wanted answered. On AI: Tracey always says please and thank you to AI, because when they take over the world she intends to be fine; Phil is more concerned about the military applications.Along the way: a four-year term referendum that never happened and probably should have, Chris’s view that the Intelligence and Security Committee should be chaired by a senior opposition MP rather than the Prime Minister, why the UK delegation that came to study New Zealand’s select committee process now has a better system than we do.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎙 Christchurch is next — part of the Word Festival, second week of September. Tickets at word.co.nz. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Penk, Peters and Citizens Arrests (LIVE with Tracey Martin) 15.08.2026 1ó 6p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines goes live at the Hannah Playhouse in Wellington — sold out in a week — with a very special guest: Tracey Martin, former deputy leader of New Zealand First, former Minister for Seniors and Children, and current CEO of the Aged Care Association.An episode that moves from the psychodrama of National’s leadership crisis to the slow-motion crisis in aged care — with an insider’s account of life in the New Zealand First caucus along the way.Thanks for Frank Risk Management, New Zealand 100% Kiwi-owned insurance brokerage - find out more at frankrisk.co.nz.In this episode:* National’s leadership crisis — Penk’s defenestration and what comes next — Phil walks through the numbers with forensic clarity: Luxon is lucky to be standing. The week that preceded the vote was arguably the worst of his premiership — the small business comments, the MMP referendum blurt, the Air Force plane to a party fundraiser, wages up 2% against inflation at 4.1%. Chris is blunt about Chris Penk: a good minister, probably not the only one involved, and now made an example pour encourager les autres. Tracey offers the most nuanced reading: what if Penk was genuinely motivated by loyalty to the party and believed a new leader would save the election?* Inside the New Zealand First caucus — and was the Peters outburst planned? — Tracey Martin spent years as one of the most senior figures in New Zealand First, and she doesn’t pull her punches. She describes her own caucus colleagues as occasionally weird — but notes that every caucus has weird people, because weird people deserve representation too. On Peters telling Lawrence Xu-Nan to go back to his own country: she had her husband check the Hansard. All Lawrence said was “are you vaccinated?” What followed was not planned — but that, she argues, might be the more alarming conclusion.* Citizens’ arrest, aged care and the promises nobody can afford — The episode’s final stretch is its most policy-dense. Chris dissects the Crimes Amendment Act’s enhanced citizens’ arrest powers: who decides what constitutes reasonable force? What happens when a 40-year-old man sits on a 15-year-old child? Phil cites the Police Association, Retail New Zealand and Business New Zealand all opposing it — because all the evidence shows that fatalities in retail crime happen when retailers chase or tackle offenders. Tracey adds the constitutional concern: the law says you can detain someone if you merely think they did it. On aged care — Tracy’s professional domain — the warning is stark: superannuation is the base funding model for all residential age care in this country. TOP’s policy of transitioning away from superannuation was designed without understanding that, and she has had to explain the consequences to them herself.Along the way: Tim Groser performing with Sam Neill at Downstage in its heyday, Annette King messaging Chris to be nice to her cousin Tracey, Chris describing himself as Captain Smack in National Party circles, Count Binface polling between 20 and 30% in Clacton and Tracy’s observation that misogynists exist in every party — not just New Zealand First.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎙 Wellington sold out. Christchurch is next — second week of September as part of the Word Christchurch Festival. Tickets available now at wordchristchurch.co.nz. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Numpties, Captains Calls and the Populist Menace (LIVE with Helen Clark) 10.08.2026 1ó 2p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines goes live at Q Theatre in Auckland — with a very special guest: the Right Honourable Helen Clark, former Prime Minister, former UNDP Administrator and member of The Elders.An episode that moves from a government having a terrible week to the West Bank, and doesn’t pull a single punch along the way.All thanks to Frank Risk Management, the 100% Kiwi Owned Insurance Brokerage. Find out more at frankrisk.co.nz.In this episode:* A bad week for Luxon, a worse week for Peters — and a referendum nobody asked for — The week opened with unemployment at 5.6% nationally, 6.5% in Auckland — the highest in eleven years — wages up 2% against inflation running at 4.1%, and Labour leading National on all five of the top issues in the Ipsos poll. Then came Luxon’s comments to small businesses — essentially telling them to stand on their own feet — which he backtracked on within hours. Helen’s verdict is pointed: to change something as fundamental as the electoral system, you need a royal commission, a proper process and a mandate — not a prime minister who’s sick of his coalition partners.* Populism, The Elders and the rise of the illiberal right — Chris is reading a book called Centrists of the World Unite and using it as a frame for the episode’s most wide-ranging conversation. He is genuinely alarmed: a potential President Le Pen next year, the AFD in Germany and Pauline Hanson in Australia. Helen welcomes Andy Burnham as a confident new leader capable of dispatching Farage and makes the structural point: social democratic and liberal centre parties have failed to build the kind of cross-bloc flexibility that the German FDP or the British Liberal Democrats offered at their best. The Opportunities Party, both Chris and Helen note, may be trying to fill that space — though Helen is sceptical of their land tax, and Phil’s concern remains unchanged: a TOP vote that falls below 5% is a vote for the status quo.* The West Bank, Gaza and Palestine disappearing before our eyes — Helen has just returned from her third visit to the West Bank as part of The Elders’ work, and her account is one of the most vivid and sobering of any episode. Seven hundred thousand illegal settlers. Israeli flags lining the roads into Palestinian villages. Tear gas thrown into schoolyards. Olive groves inaccessible. A village with one road in after the other was closed. Her conclusion, shared with The Elders: Palestine is disappearing before our eyes.Along the way: Paul Henry naming Helen Clark as the most impressive politician of recent decades, the SIS agent thrown down the stairs of the Political Studies Department in the 1970s, Raybon Kan’s line that when Peters told him to go back where he came from, he was relieved it wasn’t back to the third world — or Masterton.Warm, historically rich and more emotionally charged than any episode before it, this live show is a reminder that the best political conversation happens when three people who have actually done the job sit in a room and tell the truth.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎙 This was our Auckland live show at Q Theatre. Wellington’s Hannah Playhouse is next — with special guest Tracey Martin. Follow us so you don’t miss the announcement. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Peters' Dying Light, Data Debate and Disappearing Commissioners 03.08.2026 47p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines returns with an episode that opens on Winston Peters telling a Green MP to go back to his own country and calling China’s leaders liars — and asks why the Prime Minister is applying a different standard to racism than he did to sexism.Proudly brought to you by Frank Risk Management, the 100% kiwi-owned insurance brokerage. Find out more at frankrisk.co.nz.In this episode:* Peters goes off the rails — again, and possibly for the last time — Winston Peters told Lawrence Xu-Nan, a Green MP who has lived in New Zealand for most of his life, to go back to his own country. He then labelled China’s leadership — New Zealand’s biggest trading partner — a bunch of liars, prompting a formal rebuke from the Chinese Embassy that neither Phil nor Chris can recall happening before in their combined decades in politics. Chris reaches for Dylan Thomas — do not go gentle into that good night — and reads the whole episode as a career in its dying convulsions: disproportionate, extreme and politically self-destructive.* Economies of Doubt and Data of Hope — $3.5 billion, 280 megawatts and a debate nobody is having — DataGrid, a Singapore-based company, is planning a data centre near Invercargill that would consume more than twice the power of all 62 existing data centres in New Zealand combined. Both Phil and Chris land cautiously in favour — New Zealand would effectively be exporting sustainable energy in the form of data, worth potentially $50-70 billion in economic benefits according to the Boston Consulting Group — but both are frustrated that neither the government nor the company is making the public case.* Too many commissioners? — The episode closes on a genuine disagreement: Children’s Commissioner Claire Achmed has been removed halfway through her term after calling out worsening child poverty — 170,000 children now, up from 148,000. Phil defends her forcefully: child poverty in New Zealand is three times the developed-country average, a bipartisan approach is needed. Chris pushes back: we have too many commissioners, the role should sit with the minister responsible, and the Salvation Army, the Child Poverty Action Group and the Catholic Social Justice Commission make the case perfectly well without a separate office. They agree to disagree — and both agree the underlying problem is real, urgent and not being addressed.Along the way: Jim Bolger yelling “racist” at Peters across the House in 1995 and then sharing a bench with him two months later and Chris’ memorable answer to Michael Cullen on the Iwi Kiwi advertisement (”that was then, this is now”).Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎟 Cross Party Lines Live is sold out — Live stream available for both shows at tapliveevents.com. $10 per show or $16 for both. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Double Standards, Tariff Hypocrisy and Parliament on the Clock 27.07.2026 49p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines returns to a week that generated more podcast fallout than any episode before it — the Stuart Nash story broke on this show — and moves through Trump’s forced labour tariffs, the Iran quagmire and a parliamentary endgame that Phil and Chris think is being handled badly.All thanks to our foundational partner, Frank Risk Management - the 100% Kiwi owned insurance brokerage. Find out more at frankrisk.co.nz.In this episode:* The Nash fallout, Shane Jones’s knee pads and one rule for some — The Stuart Nash story dominated New Zealand media after breaking on Cross Party Lines, and both Phil and Chris use this episode to set the record straight on how it happened — and why Chris has no apology to make. But the more pointed argument is Phil’s: in the same week Nash was sacked by Peters for ill-judged comments about maternity leave, Shane Jones used the term “knee pads” to describe the Prime Minister’s behaviour toward Modi — a clear sexual innuendo that drew no consequences whatsoever.* Trump’s forced labour tariffs — hypocrisy dressed as principle — The Supreme Court struck down Trump’s original reciprocal tariffs six to three, so the administration has now reimposed them under a forced labour justification. Phil dismantles the argument completely: the Global Slavery Index rates the United States itself as having 1.1 million people in modern slavery, Trump has gutted domestic funding to combat forced labour, and he is simultaneously doing favourable nuclear deals with Saudi Arabia — one of the world’s worst human rights offenders.* Iran, the RMA and a parliament running out of time — Back home, 21 sitting days remain before the House rises on 24 September and the election writ is issued in early October. The order paper is heavy — the RMA replacement legislation alone will generate a hefty debate — and the government has already used urgency more than any administration since MMP, stripping select committee scrutiny from legislation that deserves it.Sharp, historically grounded and angrier than usual in all the right places, this episode is a reminder that double standards in politics — whether applied to MPs or to nuclear deals — always have consequences, and the people who pay them are rarely the ones who set them.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎟 Wellington sold out. Last few tickets for Auckland Q Theatre — 8 August with Helen Clark. Live stream also available for both shows at tapliveevents.com — $10 per show or $16 for both. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Shock Jocks, Bin Faces and the Destruction of Legacy 20.07.2026 50p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines returns with a week so packed it barely fits into an hour — Paul Henry joins ACT, Andy Burnham becomes Britain’s fourth Prime Minister in five years, Farage faces a comedian with a bin on his head, and back home, the government’s RMA and consent law moves prompt one of Chris’s angriest moments yet.Thanks to Frank Risk Management, the 100% Kiwi Owned insurance brokerage.In this episode:* Paul Henry, celebrity candidates and the history of profile without substance — ACT’s announcement of Paul Henry as a candidate generates the most entertaining segment of the episode. Phil goes through the long and largely undistinguished history of celebrity candidates in New Zealand politics — weather forecasters, All Blacks, broadcasters, and one pair of underpants — and concludes that profile without policy preparation is a recipe for disappointment.* Andy Burnham kisses hands, Farage resigns and Count Binface enters the arena — Britain has a new Prime Minister, its fifth in four years and seventh in ten. Phil and Chris welcome Andy Burnham’s communication skills, his record as Mayor of Greater Manchester, and his promise to rewire the economy for ordinary people and take power out of Westminster — while noting that the fiscal constraints facing him are identical to those that sank Starmer. The episode closes on Farage, who has resigned his Clacton seat to avoid scrutiny by the Parliamentary Standards Commissioner over his undisclosed donations, triggering a by-election against 34 candidates — including Count Binface of the Recyclon Party, whose deputy is General Waste, and whose campaign slogan is simply that he is not Nigel Farage.* Treaty arrangements, consent law, move-on orders and a government undoing its own party’s legacy — Chris makes his position unmistakable: the government’s move to overturn local council agreements with iwi is a betrayal of the National Party traditions built by Jim Bolger, Doug Graham and Ralph Hanan, done without proper process, without submissions, and in direct contradiction of assurances that such arrangements would be grandfathered. He calls the MPs responsible two-bit careerists who despise the party’s history and says so without qualification.This episode is a reminder that the traditions that hold a political party — and a country — together are easier to destroy than to build, and that the people doing the destroying rarely understand what they’ve lost.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎟 Auckland Q Theatre live show with Helen Clark — 75% sold. Wellington sold out. Get your tickets now at tapliveevents.com. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Red Carpets, Empty Roads and Pacific Diplomacy 13.07.2026 48p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines opens with a tribute to Sam Neill — actor, environmentalist and proud New Zealander. Then it’s into a packed episode that moves from Modi’s visit to Pacific power plays, and closes with a verdict on the Roads of National Significance that is not kind.Thanks to our Foundational Partner, Frank Risk Management, the 100% Kiwi owned insurance brokerage.In this episode:* Modi in Auckland — a historic visit with an unresolved $35 billion question — Phil gives the visit its due — India is on track to become the world’s third largest economy, the FTA could do for New Zealand-India trade what the China agreement did after 2008, and Modi has genuinely modernised India and lifted millions out of poverty. And the $35 billion investment commitment — mentioned three times by Modi, described as a promise by Indian trade officials, and quietly reframed as an “aspiration” by Christopher Luxon — has the makings of the 21st century version of the Treaty of Waitangi.* The Pacific power vacuum — and how New Zealand got left flat-footed — Phil and Chris are in agreement: New Zealand has dropped the ball, Foreign Affairs has missed the moment, and Penny Wong has run rings around us diplomatically. The deeper story is the vacuum created by Trump cutting US aid by 95% and declaring climate change a hoax — the two issues Pacific Island nations care most about — while China fills the gap with construction projects and red carpet treatment for small-nation leaders.* Roads of National Significance — over promised, under costed and running out of road — The announcement that multiple Roads of National Significance have no start date, no finish date and no funding lands with a thud. Phil puts the blame squarely on Simeon Brown, who as transport spokesperson costed 17 roads at $24 billion in 2023 — a figure that has since more than doubled to $56 billion. Chris asks the question nobody has answered: why does everything cost so much in New Zealand, and why does analysis paralysis set in every time a project reaches the implementation stage?.Wide-ranging, this episode is a reminder that the decisions made in Beijing, Canberra and Washington about the Pacific are not abstract — they show up in aid cuts, missile tests and the vacuum that small nations fill however they can.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎟 Auckland live show at Q Theatre — Saturday 8 August with special guest Helen Clark. Nearly 70% sold. Get your tickets now at tapliveevents.com. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Pacific Missiles, Zombie Candidates and Unpopular Anniversaries 06.07.2026 47p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines opens with breaking news — a Chinese missile test heading for the South Pacific — before working through a packed episode that moves from America at 250 to Brexit at 10, and closes with a forensic dissection of New Zealand Firsts increasingly chaotic behaviour inside the coalition.Thanks to our foundational partner Frank Risk Management, the 100% Kiwi-owned insurance brokerage.In this episode:* China’s missile test and a new American ambassador — The episode opens with China’s announcement of a test missile launch into the nuclear-free South Pacific. Phil is direct: the message to all nuclear weapon states, and particularly China, should be blunt — we don’t want your war games in our part of the world. The new American ambassador Jared Novelly gets a measured welcome the same week a survey showing New Zealanders now see China as a closer friend than the US should tell him everything he needs to know about why.* America at 250, Brexit at 10 and the John Major interview everyone should watch — Trump’s 4th of July celebrations at Mount Rushmore — labelling opponents communists, smashing down the historic East Wing of the White House — prompt a comparison with Gerry Ford’s dignified handling of the bicentennial in the shadow of Watergate. We then turns to the tenth anniversary of the Brexit vote, anchored around what Chris calls the most devastating political interview he has seen in years: John Major’s conversation with The Independent. Both strongly urge listeners to find it.* New Zealand Firsts zombie candidates, voting rights attack and Peters sabotages the India FTA — The second half turns entirely domestic. Andrea Vance’s description of New Zealand Firsts new candidate line up — a cast of embittered zombies shuffling back to reanimate their dead careers — gets enthusiastic endorsement from both Phil and Chris. And on the India FTA — Peters, as Foreign Minister, has been publicly claiming the government is discriminating against Indians, directly contradicting his own party’s prior claims of a migrant tsunami, and doing so the week before Prime Minister Modi visits New Zealand. Phil’s verdict: this is deliberate sabotage of the free trade agreement.Along the way: Helen Clark confirmed as special guest for the Auckland live show at Q Theatre, Chris’s law clerk Oliver from Leeds asking why he can’t vote and a reminder that the lessons of Brexit are the lessons of every populist movement that has come before it.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎟 Auckland live show at Q Theatre — 8 August. Helen Clark joins Phil and Chris on stage. Tickets at tapliveevents.com. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Trade Skills, Clean Energy and Opportunities Up 29.06.2026 49p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines goes fully domestic this week — a weekend of wall-to-wall policy announcements gives the panel plenty to work with, a centrist party is suddenly polling close to the threshold, and a government that spent three years going hard on conservation and fisheries has quietly started walking backwards.All thanks to Frank Risk Management, the 100% Kiwi Owned Insurance Brokerage.In this episode:* Labour’s apprenticeship push, National’s solar moment and a rare weekend of good policy — Labour’s congress produced one headline announcement: fully funded apprenticeships for the first two years, reinstating a scheme National halved in government. National’s solar panel policy gets a warmer reception than expected from both sides: electricity prices up, panel costs down, and every party bar ACT now backing some form of solar subsidy.* The Opportunities Party — four percent and rising — With TOP polling at 4.1% in the Herald poll of polls and as high as 4.6% in some variants, Phil and Chris give the centrist party its most forensic examination yet. Chris invokes Peter Dunne’s historical observation — in MMP, no party has ever entered parliament from outside without an existing MP.* Conservation backdowns, fisheries farce and the ninth floor asleep at the wheel — Tama Potaka’s partial retreat on the Conservation Amendment Bill draws a pointed parallel from Phil: this is John Key’s 2010 Schedule Four debacle replayed, almost scene for scene. Forty thousand people marched up Queen Street then. The same constituencies — trampers, Forest and Bird, Greenpeace, coastal communities — are mobilising now.Along the way: Key as the ultimate Teflon politician and the heartbreak of trying to make things stick to him, wallabies crossing the Rangitāiki River as an emerging conservation crisis and Pauline Hanson’s maternity leave blunder costing her three points overnight.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎟 Wellington is sold out. Auckland tickets still available at tapliveevents.com. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Wasted Millions, Starmer Sacrificed and Cross Party KiwiSaver (?) 22.06.2026 52p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines returns for a policy-heavy episode — a weekend of conference announcements, party platforms and pre-election positioning gives Phil and Chris more material than they can get through in an hour, and they try anyway.All thanks to Frank Risk Management, our foundational partner and the 100% kiwi owned insurance brokerage.In this episode:* $32 million, nothing to show and the eternal curse of government IT — Immigration New Zealand’s biometric system has consumed $32 million and produced precisely nothing. Phil and Chris trace the familiar pattern: INCIS in the nineties, Novopay, and now this. Chris wants a centralised specialist IT contract unit in government rather than every department reinventing the wheel. Phil adds a sharper question: if the public service can’t get biometrics right, what on earth makes anyone think it can safely replace 9,000 workers with AI?* KiwiSaver, Green taxes and the election’s big policy weekend — National’s conference in Lower Hutt produced the headline announcement: compulsory KiwiSaver contributions rising to six percent. Chris calls it a seismic and welcome shift — one of Cullen’s great legacies, finally being taken seriously. Phil agrees in principle but worries hard about low-income workers living week to week, and raises a troubling allegation from a trade union that some employers are substituting KiwiSaver contributions for wage rises, meaning workers are effectively funding both sides. The Greens launched a sweeping tax package — inheritance tax above a million dollars, wealth tax, higher corporate rates, bank levies, tech company withholding tax.* Starmer’s last days, reform’s wobble and the UK’s revolving door — Three British by-elections dominate the international segment. Andy Burnham cleaned up reform in Makerfield — a white working-class seat reform was confident about — while the Conservatives beat reform in Aberdeen South and held on in Angus East. Chris is delighted: reform may have peaked. Farage is being investigated over a £5 million payment. And Kemi Badenoch, about whom Chris had initial doubts, is fighting a genuine rebuilding effort from the pavement. Phil counts the prime ministers: if Burnham succeeds Starmer, Britain will have had seven in ten years.Along the way: the Parliamentary Budget Office gaining rare cross-party momentum with both Willis and Sepuloni expressing support, Labour’s transport fare cap policy and the $30 million costing dispute versus National’s roads of national significance out by $30 billion and Chris washing his mouth out with soap for agreeing with Shane Jones twice…Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎟 Wellington is almost sold out. Auckland still has tickets. Get in now at tapliveevents.com. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Trumps War, Commuter Policy and Missing Money 15.06.2026 53p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines returns for an episode that moves from the Iran peace deal to the election campaign taking shape around them.And all thanks to our foundational partner, Frank Risk Management, the 100% Kiwi Owned Insurance Brokerage.In this episode:* The Iran deal — incomplete, expensive and Trump’s to own — A purported peace deal between the US, Israel and Iran arrived as this episode was recording, and both Phil and Chris give it a cautious and sceptical reception. Chris has read the Obama agreement and the Trump version side by side: Obama’s was more comprehensive.* Election season: polls, Peters and the Rakesh Naidoo affair — With four months to go, the election campaign is warming up fast. National is hovering at 29-30%, low enough that — on David Farrar’s own modelling — they would return just two list MPs, potentially losing Nicola Willis and Chris Bishop from cabinet. The Opportunities Party is polling near the threshold in one poll and nowhere near it in two others; Phil’s warning to progressive voters is direct: a TOP vote that doesn’t cross 5% is effectively a vote for the current government.* Where’s the money coming from — and who’s counting it? — Nicola Willis has accused Labour of $18 billion in unfunded promises. Phil points out that National announced its fiscal plan two weeks before the 2023 election. Both agree the real fix is a Parliamentary Budget Office — independent, empowered to cost everyone’s promises, and long overdue. Australia has one. Canada has one. Victoria and New South Wales have one. ACT and New Zealand First have blocked it. Phil and Chris end the episode in rare complete agreement: this is an idea whose time has come.Sharp, wide-ranging and more electorally focused than usual, this episode is a reminder that with four months to go, the campaign has already started — and some of the most consequential moves are being made before a single vote is cast.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎟 Live shows — Auckland 8 August, Wellington 12 August. Wellington is 85% sold. Get your tickets now at tapliveevents.com. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Beijing, Buried Emails and Telling America Where to Go 08.06.2026 51p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines welcomes Phil back from China with a packed episode that moves from the streets of Beijing to the corridors of Parliament — and closes with a sharp verdict on American politicians who can’t stop telling other countries what to do.Thanks to our foundational partner, Frank Risk Management, the 100% Kiwi owned insurance brokerage.In this episode:* Phil’s China dispatch — infrastructure, trade and a more controlling Beijing — Phil’s first China visit in nine years left him genuinely impressed and genuinely concerned in equal measure. The infrastructure shames us and the air in Beijing is so clean it’s unrecognisable from the smog-choked city he visited in the 2000s.* Lobbying, Gmail accounts and the OIA that disappeared — Emails sent to the Prime Minister’s principal policy advisor’s private Gmail account — from Fonterra in June 2024 and Z Energy in July 2024, both lobbying on the Mike Smith climate litigation — were never disclosed under OIA requests. Phil is unambiguous: two separate incidents, two private email accounts, no disclosure. This was not a stuff-up. Chris thinks it was probably cock-up rather than conspiracy, but agrees the Official Information Act needs teeth.* Hegseth, Vance and the Americans who won’t stay in their lane — Pete Hegseth managed to enrage most of Western Europe with an immigration rant at D-Day commemorations. JD Vance tried to weaponise the killing of an 18-year-old student by a British-born Sikh to score points about mass migration. Phil’s response is the most direct of the episode: New Zealand has nothing to apologise for, the Yanks were late for both world wars, and Mike Moore’s line captures it perfectly — we might do anything you ask, we won’t do anything you tell us.Wide-ranging, historically rich and sharper than usual on democratic accountability, this episode is a reminder that the same principles apply whether you’re talking about Beijing, Wellington or Washington: transparency matters, sovereignty matters, and the rules only work if everyone plays by them.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.🎟 Live shows — Auckland 8 August, Wellington 12 August. General sale now open at tapliveevents.com. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Budget In, Stuart Out — and Is Australia Actually Better? 01.06.2026 51p

  Hosted by Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines welcomes a familiar face from across the Tasman, special guest co-host Annette King — beaming in from Sydney while Phil is in China.All thanks to our foundational partner, Frank Risk Management. The 100% kiwi owned insurance brokerage.🎟 Live shows — Auckland 8 August, Wellington 12 August. Podcast listeners get pre-sale access. Head to tapliveevents.com and use code CPL26 (all caps).In this episode:* Nicola Willis’s budget — a bit of this, a bit of that — Annette gives her verdict: not easily named, cautiously welcomed on health and defence, but carrying the familiar ring of a surplus promise that every New Zealand government makes and few deliver. The conversation deepens quickly into the long shadow of the Muldoon decision to abolish the contributory super scheme in the 1970s — a move both Annette and Chris agree was one of the great shames of New Zealand politics.* Australia’s CGT tweak, broken promises and the lessons for New Zealand — Jim Chalmers’ budget included changes to capital gains tax concessions for investors — not promised, immediately attacked by the Liberals as a broken promise, and now a test of whether Labour can hold its nerve. Annette has enormous respect for Chalmers as a treasurer and thinks the changes are defensible — but acknowledges that the optics of doing what Bill Shorten proposed in 2019 and lost an election over are not straightforward.* The Liberal Party’s death spiral, One Nation’s rise and the Barnaby Joyce problem — Tony Abbott, newly installed as Liberal Party president after losing his own seat to a teal in 2019, is Chris and Annette’s exhibit A for a party that has lost the plot. The old Liberal heartland — Wentworth, Warringah, North Sydney — is now teal territory. One Nation has won its first lower house seat. And the Liberal response, apparently, is to move further right. Both agree this is a guaranteed path to irrelevance.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Cuts, Culture Wars and the Cost of a Frigate 25.05.2026 48p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines dive into a budget week episode that is almost entirely domestic: 8,700 public service jobs cut, state house rents going up, culture war bills clogging Parliament, and a defence announcement both men broadly welcome but want to interrogate.Cross Party Lines is made possible by Frank Risk Management, the 100% Kiwi owned insurance brokerage.In this episode:* 8,700 jobs — efficiency or ideology dressed as savings? — The government’s announcement of a 14% public service reduction draws a forensic and at times sharp response from both sides. Phil’s theory: this was never about efficiency — it was about finding $2.5 billion before the credit rating agencies moved again, and the justification was built around the number, not the other way around.* Social housing - who pays the bill?— The social housing changes draw Phil’s sharpest words of the episode: $31 a week more from people who are, by definition, at the bottom of New Zealand’s social and economic heap. Chris asks whether Margaret Thatcher had a good idea selling council houses to their occupiers and we pass judgment on Nicola Willis’ “lotto” comment.* Defence — necessary, expensive and long overdue — The pre-budget defence announcement draws broad agreement: New Zealand spent two decades at 1% of GDP on defence during what Helen Clark correctly called a strategically benign environment. That environment no longer exists. The frigates are nearly 30 years old. Ships sit at Devonport without enough crew to sail them. Any government serious about defence has to make the career attractive enough to keep the sergeant majors you can’t simply replace.Along the way: a tribute to Jules Topp, Stuart Nash’s road-to-Damascus conversion to New Zealand First forensically dismantled, ministerial housing horror stories including Phil’s garage demolished by the USA and Chris tormenting Annette King about childhood dentistryCross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too.Live shows announced — Auckland 8 August, Wellington 12 August. Podcast listeners get early access to tickets next week. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Budgets, Basics and Bilaterals 18.05.2026 37p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, Cross Party Lines returns — fresh off the stage at Featherston — for an episode that opens with a tribute to one of New Zealand’s greatest legal minds and moves through a week of elections, populist tremors and an education debate that has been going around in circles since the 1990s.Thanks to Frank Risk Management, the 100% Kiwi owned insurance brokerage.In this episode:* The Trump-Xi summit — pomp, ceremony and a ridiculous mouse — Chris reaches for the Latin poet Horace to deliver his verdict: all the hype, all the ceremony, and nothing of substance emerged. No breakthrough on Taiwan, 200 Boeings ordered instead of the promised 500, and none of the Nixonian moment that a genuine Sino-American summit could have been.* The pre-budget squeeze — $300 million less and nowhere to hide — The government has cut its operational allowance from $2.4 billion to $2.1 billion, meaning $300 million less new spending in a budget that already has to find money for defence, health, education and law and order. Phil is blunt: there will be cuts, the lolly scramble is off, and Labour faces the same fiscal straitjacket as the government it hopes to replace.* NCEA — a debate going around in circles since the 1990s — Phil and Chris both remember this argument from when they were on opposite sides of the House. The OECD’s early 2000s push toward skills over knowledge went too far; the pendulum is swinging back; but the question is whether it’s swinging with the evidence or against it. Phil is particularly troubled by a cabinet paper that acknowledges the reforms will likely reduce achievement rates for Māori, Pasifika and low-income students — a problem New Zealand already has and cannot afford to worsen.Along the way: a tribute to Sir Ken Keith, New Zealand’s only ever ICJ judge; the opera about Nixon in China that Chris thinks was pretty bad; why nationalising the BNZ for $24 billion is both impossible and unaffordable; a mystery special guest joining Chris in two weeks while Phil travels to China; and a big live show announcement coming next week.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com
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  Question Time: Live from Booktown (Bonus) 14.05.2026 23p

  Hosted by Phil Goff and Chris Finlayson, this is a special bonus episode of Cross Party Lines — the live Q&A from the Featherston Booktown Festival, released separately so nothing from that remarkable afternoon gets left on the cutting room floor. Before the questions, Sam takes the temperature of the 400-strong room with four quick audience polls.The audience then takes over:* Could the Opportunity Party break Winston Peters’ cycle?* Should political parties be state funded?* The Electoral Act rollback — disenfranchisement by design?* Is voting for the two big parties really enough to stop populism?Along the way: Trevor Mallard in the audience demanding short questions, Judith Tizard’s advice on grand coalitions, Marion Hobbs telling Chris not to read The Economist during Question Time and Sam’s emotional farewell to his first and last live audience.This bonus episode is a reminder that when you put 400 curious New Zealanders in a room and give them a microphone, something rather good happens.Cross Party Lines exists to lift political literacy and create space for calm, good-faith political conversation. New episodes every Tuesday. If you value thoughtful debate, follow the podcast and share it with someone who might too. This is a public episode. If you would like to discuss this with other subscribers or get access to bonus episodes, visit crosspartylines.substack.com