Chain of Learning: Leadership Strategies for Transforming Culture, Developing People, and Getting Results

Epizode

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  82| Connect the Parts, Focus on People: Inside the Toyota Economic System [with Olivier Larue] 19.08.2026 57min

  Profit or cash. Efficiency or flexibility. Speed, or doing it right.Leaders feel like they have to make trade-offs like these all the time. But the choice often isn't real.Some contradictions are unavoidable. Others only look that way until you understand the real problem. The most effective organizations realize they don't have to pick a side if they can resolve the underlying tension.Olivier Larue has spent three decades helping companies do this, which he's documented in his three-book series The Toyota Economic System: a philosophy about people and society, the technical design that turns it into results, and the management practices that keep it alive through continuous learning.The real breakthrough is never the tools, optimizing one part of the system, or making unnecessary tradeoffs. It's how every part connects, and understanding the real problem to solve, so people remain the focus and results last.You’ll Learn:How to tell a contradiction that's real from one that only looks real, so you stop choosing between things you can't afford to loseWhy an economic lens, not an operational one, changes where you look for the answerWhy the number and order of Toyota's seven wastes aren't arbitrary, and why the first one drives how you understand the restWhy declaring people "empowered" means nothing without the conditions that let them act on itHow respect for people extends to avoiding layoffs even in downturns, and why that matters in a world of AI and supply chain disruptionsABOUT MY GUEST:Olivier Larue was trained by Toyota Motor Corporation and has spent thirty years helping Fortune 500 companies design and implement industrial manufacturing solutions, including more than a decade as a consultant with TSSC, the Toyota Production System Support Center, and hands-on work in the biopharmaceutical industry. He is the founder and president of Ydatum, and the author of the three-book series The Toyota Economic System.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/82 Connect with Olivier Larue: linkedin.com/in/olivierlarue Purchase a copy of The Toyota Economic System (three-book series): https://www.amazon.com/Toyota-Economic-System-Environmental-StewardshipLearn more about Ydatum: ydatum.com Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson Subscribe to my newsletter: kbjanderson.com/newsletter Check out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.com Join us on the Japan Leadership Experience: KBJAnderson.com/japantrip TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:02:43 How a NUMMI experience shaped Olivier years later05:14 Why call it the Toyota Economic System?09:42 Profit vs. cash: the trade-off companies get wrong12:32 Why Just-in-Time doesn’t mean zero inventory16:30 What happens when company values and work conflict20:20 Why leaders have to “earn” how they manage21:42 Why Toyota’s seven wastes are in a specific order23:38 The hidden cost of human waiting27:20 Why leadership skills alone aren’t enough30:05 Why organizations keep repeating the same problems31:26 What Andon actually means for empowerment35:17 The leadership response that makes problems safe to surface39:16 Why Toyota can avoid layoffs during downturns44:30 The unanswered question about AI and economic growth48:30 How enthusiasm turns pull into push50:44 Why isolated improvements don’t transform systems54:35 Refusing the either/or trade-off
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  81| Adapt How You Lead: Situational Leadership in Practice [with Suzie Bishop] 05.08.2026 38min

  Your leadership style isn't the problem. Your default is.The gap between how you're leading and what the person in front of you actually needs is one of the most common and most invisible places leaders get stuck. Most of us default to one mode and don't notice the mismatch until something breaks down.Suzie Bishop has spent over a decade at the Center for Leadership Studies helping leaders close that gap and strengthen their leadership effectiveness. Her new book, Situational Leadership, puts nearly sixty years of research into a practical framework for reading the situation, building leadership flexibility, and adapting your approach.Suzie walks through the four leadership styles, how to read what someone needs in a given situation, and how to adapt your approach to coach, develop leaders, and lead through influence.The best leaders don't pick one style and commit. They pause, assess the situation, and flex to have the impact you intend.You’ll Learn:Why "leadership is influence" reframes how you lead, and why influence has nothing to do with manipulation or controlHow to diagnose what someone needs, and why one person can require four different approaches in the same conversationHow leadership flexibility and adaptability differ—and why knowing the styles isn't the same as knowing when to use themWhy only asking coaching questions can leave people stuck, and how to know when to step in with more directive leadershipHow the "power of the pause" helps you move from reacting out of habit to adapting with intentionABOUT MY GUEST:Suzie Bishop is VP of Product Development at The Center for Leadership Studies. She's a Certified Professional in Training Management, a Stakeholder Centered Coach, and a Marshall Goldsmith 100 Coach. Suzie is co-author of Situational Leadership: The Model for Leading Others, Navigating Change and Unlocking Performance and is currently writing her next book, Match: How to Meet Leaders Where They Are, with Marshall Goldsmith.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/81 Connect with Suzie Bishop: linkedin.com/in/suzie-bishop Purchase a copy: Situational Leadership: The Model for Leading Others, Navigating Change and Unlocking Performance by Suzie Bishop and Sam ShriverMatch: How to Meet Leaders Where They Are by Suzie Bishop and Marshall Goldsmith (November 2026)Learn more about The Center for Leadership Studies: situational.comFollow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson Subscribe to my newsletter: kbjanderson.com/newsletter Check out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.com Join us on the Japan Leadership Experience: KBJAnderson.com/japantrip TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:02:52 Why leadership is influence, not control04:43 Creating the conditions without controlling06:51 What Situational Leadership looks like in practice07:35 Flexibility vs. adaptability: the critical difference07:48 The four Situational Leadership styles11:41 How to recognize your natural leadership tendency13:08 When asking questions isn’t effective coaching16:46 How to be directive without taking away ownership17:37 The cost of not adapting how you lead21:37 Why organizations need a common leadership language24:05 Creating the conditions for people to ask for help25:24 The leadership challenge even top executives struggle with29:06 How to give direction without taking over30:33 Influence versus control when you have authority31:06 Three types of power that shape your influence32:51 Why trust is your most important source of power36:02 The difference between flexibility and adaptability37:08 Practice an intention pause before you respond
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  80| Bad News First: How a Leader's Response Builds a Culture of Learning [with Isao Yoshino] 22.07.2026 44min

  How many problems are actually visible in your organization?Research shows senior leaders see just 4%. The other 96% stay hidden — invisible, yet still there. And some aren't even recognized by employees as problems anymore, because they have become the norm.We all say we want psychological safety. But you don't get it by saying you want it. People-centered leadership is about creating conditions for people to speak up and highlight issues by how you, and leaders across your system, respond.Recorded live with a group of global leaders participating in my Japan Leadership Experience in May 2026, this special episode celebrates the sixth anniversary of Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn. You'll hear Isao Yoshino, a 40-year Toyota leader and the subject of my book, reflect on three of the book's most talked-about stories.These examples bring two of Toyota's mottos to life, "bad news first" and "no problem is a problem," and show why a leader's response is what turns problems into a culture of improvement:How his manager's response to a huge paint-shop mistake in his first months at Toyota shaped how he saw a leader's roleHow andon — signaling a problem and stopping the line — changed the culture at NUMMIHow he found the courage to highlight his failing water ski boat business to President Fujio ChoWhether on the front line or in the boardroom, creating the conditions where bad news comes first, and support follows, is what builds a culture of excellence.You’ll Learn:Why a leader's response to a mistake is fundamental to effective leadership and matters more than the mistake itselfThe two actions behind a bad-news-first culture: respond down to help, not blame, and signal up when something's off courseWhy andon is a leadership practice, not just a factory signal, that works from the shop floor to the executive suiteWhat the NUMMI turnaround shows about culture change: people adopt a better way when they discover it, not when they're toldWhy "thank you for this mistake" is the keystone move for building psychological safetyABOUT MY GUEST:Isao Yoshino spent forty years at Toyota, from the late 1960s to the early 2000s, where he helped shape the people-centered learning culture the company is known for today. He was a key leader in the Kan-Pro senior-management development program and led the training of the American managers at NUMMI, the Toyota-GM joint venture, where he hired John Shook. He is the subject of Katie Anderson's Shingo Publication Award-winning book, Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/80Order your copy of Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn: LearningToLeadLeadingToLearn.comFollow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjandersonSubscribe to my newsletter: kbjanderson.com/newsletterCheck out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.comJoin us on the Japan Leadership Experience: KBJAnderson.com/japantripTIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:02:18 Andon: Why a leader's response matters03:16 The paint mistake that shaped Mr. Yoshino's leadership05:28 Why Mr. Yoshino was thanked for his mistake09:34 The leadership lesson that lasted 40 years11:22 Why Toyota starts every leader on the front line12:18 Inside the early days of NUMMI17:13 Why workers were afraid to stop the line23:34 What changed the culture at NUMMI24:40 Why leaders only see 4% of problems25:16 Responding down instead of blaming25:50 Asking for help at the leadership level28:43 Why President Cho flew to a failing business34:17 The power of bad news first35:54 Mr. Yoshino's biggest leadership regret38:19 When doing it yourself becomes the problem39:05 The response that creates culture40:28 The two behaviors every leader needs42:02 Two questions to reflect on this week
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  79| Build Powerful People: Why Transformation Starts with Your Own [with Gary Peterson] 08.07.2026 56min

  Efficiency and cost savings aren't what makes operational excellence last. People are.The leaders who create enduring, high-performing organizations are after something beyond business results. They want a company where people end the day more capable, more confident, more energized than when it began. That's the difference between a workplace that wears people down and one that builds powerful people.Gary Peterson spent more than 30 years building that kind of culture of continuous improvement at OC Tanner. But the hardest part wasn't creating the systems or processes to get better outcomes. It was his own transformation — coming to see how, without meaning to, he'd become the leader getting in his people's way.Put people first, and the results follow. And the deepest transformation you'll ever lead is your own.You’ll Learn:Why operational excellence only lasts when leaders focus on building people, not just cutting costs and eliminating wasteWhy the best leaders make an identity shift from being the expert with every answer to creating the conditions for others to solve problemsWhat it takes to move managers from enforcers to coaches and make continuous improvement something your team never fears, even as roles and headcount shiftHow to influence real organizational change when you have no authority to make anyone followWhy so many leaders give up on culture change too soon, and how long it really takesABOUT MY GUEST:Gary Peterson spent more than 30 years at OC Tanner, where he held leadership roles across manufacturing, marketing, and operations, most recently as Executive Vice President of Supply Chain and Manufacturing. He led the people-first transformation that earned OC Tanner the Shingo Prize and made it one of the few companies Toyota holds up as a global showcase for its system outside automotive. Gary is an Association for Manufacturing Excellence Hall of Fame inductee.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/79 Connect with Gary Peterson: linkedin.com/in/garypeterson Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson Subscribe to my newsletter: kbjanderson.com/newsletter Check out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.com Join me on the Japan Leadership Experience: KBJAnderson.com/japantripTIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:03:44 Why Toyota saw something different at OC Tanner05:02 The real purpose of operational excellence07:19 How Gary knew the culture was changing09:00 Creating people who change the world12:13 The outcome every leader should want13:07 Two pillars that shaped the journey14:26 Breaking a culture of fear and control15:35 The five-minute habit that changed everything17:15 Redefining what it means to be a manager19:12 Why transformation takes longer than you think20:05 What to do when leaders don't support the change22:26 The experiment that almost got shut down24:19 Helping managers make the coaching shift25:23 When people outgrow their leaders28:28 Why improvement should never threaten jobs30:23 The manager who couldn't stop yelling32:23 The leadership habit that destroys ownership35:35 Becoming the leader you never wanted to be37:00 The habit that was holding people back38:01 The executive behavior that shuts people down40:07 Proving your worth vs. creating conditions45:37 Showing results isn't the same as showing people49:53 Where transformation really begins51:16 The question every leader should ask about their people53:34 When helping starts limiting growth55:14 The shift that made everything else possible
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  78| Strategy Isn't Enough: 9 Practices to Help Your Team Meet the Moment [with Karina Mangu-Ward] 24.06.2026 40min

  Have you poured months into a strategy your team couldn't bring to life? Or watched capable people work harder than ever, and still struggle to pull together as a team?High performance isn't about a better strategy, more talent, or longer hours. It's about how your team works together, every single day.Karina Mangu-Ward, author of Teams That Meet the Moment, has spent more than a decade helping complex organizations redesign the messy day-to-day of how people actually get things done together. Her belief: good everyday teaming habits are both good for people and good for results. You don't have to choose between them.Making this real doesn't require a reinvention. You just need the right structure and the intention to show up differently. In this episode, Karina shares simple, tangible practices you can use in your very next meeting or strategic project.You’ll Learn:The three lies leaders tell themselves about teamwork, and why believing them holds your team backHow the framework of the "Even Over" ends the swirl when your team is stuck choosing between two competing optionsWhy creating a "Safe to Try" process gets a team unstuck when you're chasing consensus and certaintyWhat a steady team cadence unlocks when everything around you feels like an emergencyThe instinct nearly every high performer has to unlearn before they can build a team that thrivesABOUT MY GUEST:Karina Mangu-Ward is a partner at August Public, an organizational change consultancy that helps large, complex organizations build more human-centered ways of working, whose clients include PepsiCo, Planned Parenthood, and Sundance. She's the author of Teams That Meet the Moment: 9 Practices for Unlocking Performance and Growth in Uncertain Times. Karina's passion is helping groups navigate complexity, gain insight, and unlock highly complex challenges.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/78 Connect with Karina: linkedin.com/in/karina-mangu-ward Purchase a copy of Karina's book: Teams That Meet the MomentLearn more about Karina’s company: aug.co Take the Team assessment: assessment.aug.co Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson Subscribe to my newsletter: kbjanderson.com/newsletter Check out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.com Join us on the Japan Leadership Experience: KBJAnderson.com/japantrip TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:03:01 Why great strategy still fails04:13 The hustle culture myth that's burning teams out05:20 Everyday habits drive extraordinary teams07:11 Meeting the moment in uncertain times09:13 The "Safe to Try" mindset that breaks gridlock11:18 Setting guardrails without limiting innovation12:06 Why small bets outperform big risks13:29 Unlearning the need to have the answer15:17 Why sticky practices beat complicated frameworks17:16 Simple retrospectives that strengthen learning20:19 The surprising cost of treating everything like an emergency22:09 Using "Even Over" to make better trade-offs25:28 Intention over reaction in decision-making30:32 When perfection becomes procrastination31:53 Why working in public accelerates learning34:22 The power of stories over instruction37:08 Intention + practice = better leadership39:14 What trade-off do you need to make?
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  77| Lead with Joy: A Business Strategy for Success [with Rich Sheridan] 10.06.2026 53min

  Joy isn't a perk. It's a business strategy.Have you ever wondered whether work has to feel this hard? Whether the team you've built can actually function without you? Whether there's a way to lead that doesn't burn you — or your people — out?Rich Sheridan built Menlo Innovations around one bold idea: ending human suffering in the workplace. The result is a company where joy isn't a slogan. It's how things actually get done. It's a place built on collaboration, human energy, and pride in what people create together.Joy isn't constant happiness. It's the long arc of meaning and contribution alongside people who care. And it becomes possible the moment you stop being the center of every problem and start creating the conditions for ownership, continuous learning, and yes, joy.You don't have to change the world. You just have to change your world.You’ll Learn:The mistake most leaders make about mistakes, and why more mistakes can get you ahead fasterWhy what looks like a questionable decision from below makes sense from aboveThe difference between joy and happiness, and why most leaders are chasing the wrong thingWhy running a small experiment will move you further than creating the perfect planWhat it really takes to build a company designed to last a hundred yearsABOUT MY GUEST:Rich Sheridan is the co-founder, CEO, and Chief Storyteller of Menlo Innovations, a software development and consulting firm known for its people-centered culture and focus on joy in the workplace. He is the author of Joy, Inc. and Chief Joy Officer and was inducted into the Shingo Academy in 2022 for his contributions to organizational excellence.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/77Connect with Rich Sheridan: linkedin.com/in/menloprezFollow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjandersonSubscribe to my newsletter: kbjanderson.com/newsletterCheck out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.comJoin us on the Japan Leadership Experience: KBJAnderson.com/japantripPurchase a copy of Rich's books: Joy, Inc. and Chief Joy OfficerLearn more about Menlo Innovations: menloinnovations.comTugboat Institute: tugboatinstitute.comTIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:02:37 When work no longer feels sustainable05:26 The moment Rich realized the problem wasn't technology07:27 What an 8-year-old noticed about leadership08:23 Why hero-based organizations scale through exhaustion09:39 When caring becomes carrying12:21 The codependency leaders develop with crises14:09 What joy at work actually means17:13 Working with pride and delighting customers19:17 Why human energy is a leadership responsibility21:00 What's the cost of not having joy?23:28 From constant firefighting to two emergencies in 25 years25:24 Joy vs. happiness: What's the difference?27:02 Why joy isn't happiness every day32:17 The phrase that keeps Menlo moving forward 34:15 The leadership lesson Rich learned from flying40:39 Why Menlo isn't chasing exponential growth43:02 The book that changed Rich's career45:18 Why crisis practices work when there isn't a crisis47:28 Why your system keeps producing the same results49:38 The shift from carrying to creating conditions for change leadership51:46 Why stepping in can hold people back
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  76 | What Is the Purpose of Kaizen? John Shook Answers Your Questions (Part 3 of 3) 27.05.2026 28min

  What does it really take to sustain a culture of continuous improvement –  through pressure for results, across generations, and into an era of AI?In this final episode of my three-part series with John Shook, one of the most influential leaders and thinkers in the global lean community, we turned to the questions on your mind. Before we sat down to record, I asked listeners to submit your questions. We cover four of them specifically here, though many others were addressed in Parts 1 and 2, and together they highlight the tensions change leaders and executives face every day.At the end, as we promised in Part 2, John shares his parting reflections and advice for all of us leading transformation to create people-centered learning cultures. It’s not just what we should stop doing, it’s what we need to continue. Starting with ourselves.If you haven't listened to episodes 74 and 75 yet, start there first as you won’t want to miss hearing this conversation in full.You'll Learn:Why leaders should be patient for results but impatient for actionWhy getting to the assumptions that underlie your principles and values is where the real work of culture change beginsHow aligning around the real problem to solve helps close the gap across generations and perspectivesWhat the original intention of jidoka — separating machine work from human work — can teach us about navigating AI and keeping technology in service of peopleThe real purpose of kaizen and continuous improvementABOUT MY GUEST:John Shook spent eleven years with Toyota in Japan and the U.S., where he helped transfer the Toyota Production System globally. He later served as President of the Lean Enterprise Institute and Chairman of the Lean Global Network.John is the co-author of the award-winning books Learning to See and Managing to Learn, and wrote the foreword to my book Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn. As an industrial anthropologist, he brings a perspective that connects culture, systems, and practice to bridge deep thinking with real-world application.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/76Connect with John Shook: lean.org/about-lei/senior-advisors-staff/john-shook/ Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson Subscribe to my newsletter: kbjanderson.com/newsletterCheck out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.comJoin us on the Japan Leadership Experience: KBJAnderson.com/japantrip Purchase a copy of, “Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn,”: https://kbjanderson.com/learning-to-lead/ TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:02:28 [Listener Question] How do you balance patience with action?04:06 Avoiding solution jumping and analysis paralysis05:20 [Listener Question] What will matter most for the next generation of organizations?07:21 Why underlying assumptions matter more than artifacts08:28 The deeper level of hansei and reflection08:53 [Listener Question] How do you bridge generations without slowing improvement?10:43 Quick PDCA vs. long-cycle learning11:23 Aligning people around shared purpose13:56 [Listener Question] In our age of AI, how do we stay true to jidoka's original intent, separating machine work from human work?14:12 AI, jidoka, and protecting human work15:23 Four questions to navigate uncertainty16:17 Why respect for people still matters in AI17:15 Jidoka beyond “automation with a human touch”18:54 Curiosity, experiments, and learning with AI19:30 The promise and risk of AI thinking for us22:08 PDCA beyond engineering and problem solving25:39 The purpose of kaizen is to do more kaizen26:18 Creating conditions for people to think and grow27:00 Shifting from leading change to creating conditions
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  75 | The Human Side of Lean: John Shook on Building Systems That Last (Part 2 of 3) 20.05.2026 47min

  Lean has always been about people. We just kept reaching for the tools, without understanding the human purpose behind them.In part two of my three-part conversation with John Shook, we go behind the scenes of Toyota's culture and leadership — sharing stories of the system-building leaders who actually made it what it is, and exploring what it really means to lead people-centered change.John shares behind-the-scenes reflections from his time inside Toyota that you might not have heard before. Drawing on his direct experience in the company and our shared experiences living and working in Japan and globally, we explore a critical feature that is often missed: lean has always been a socio-technical system. The tools only work when we understand the deeper human purpose behind them.In this episode, we talk about the people who actually built Toyota's culture, what John learned from his two very different bosses — including Isao Yoshino, the subject of my book “Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn” — and what happens when we lose sight of the human purpose inside the tools we practice every day.In the previous episode, John offered a powerful reframe on lean's impact — and what question we should really be asking as change leaders. If you haven't listened to episode 74 yet, hit pause and start there first — then come back to this one to pick up where we left off.You'll Learn:Inside stories of how Toyota's culture was built and the system builders behind itWhat John learned from his very different bosses inside Toyota and how their styles shaped his own leadershipWhether you are a lean “mechanic” or “social worker” and what your answer reveals about your leadershipWhy every lean tool is already socio-technical — kanban, standardized work, A3, andon — and what we lost when we introduced them as primarily technicalThe concept of motainai — waste as a moral failure, not just a technical one — and why this matters for how you leadABOUT MY GUEST:John Shook spent eleven years with Toyota in Japan and the U.S., where he helped transfer the Toyota Production System globally. He later served as President of the Lean Enterprise Institute and Chairman of the Lean Global Network.John is the co-author of the award-winning books Learning to See and Managing to Learn, and wrote the foreword to my book Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn. As an industrial anthropologist, he brings a perspective that connects culture, systems, and practice to bridge deep thinking with real-world application.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/75Connect with John Shook: lean.org/about-lei/senior-advisors-staff/john-shook/ Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson Subscribe to my newsletter: kbjanderson.com/newsletterCheck out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.comJoin us on the Japan Leadership Experience: KBJAnderson.com/japantrip Purchase a copy of, “Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn,”: kbjanderson.com/learning-to-lead TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:03:04 Why changing culture is harder than copying systems04:05 John’s question that still drives him: Why Toyota?05:10 How John found his way into Toyota and NUMMI06:15 Why Toyota endured while other Japanese companies faded07:10 Short-term leaders vs. long-term system builders08:15 The crisis that shaped Toyota’s future direction10:05 John’s experience learning from very different Toyota leaders11:15 Why conflicting feedback accelerated John’s learning12:10 Bringing your own thinking into the A3 process13:15 Different cultures inside Toyota and how they shaped leadership14:10 Mr. Cho’s powerful way of teaching through stories16:10 Katie’s lion story and breaking the telling habit17:15 Adapting your leadership approach to the situation19:15 Reading both the technical and social sides of change20:20 TPS as a way to expose weaknesses and accelerate growth21:45 Are you a lean mechanic or a lean social worker?22:50 Identifying your leadership bias and growth edge24:05 Why process improvement and OD teams should work together27:10 Scientific thinking, humanism, and ethics in Toyota leadership28:55 Eliminating waste as more than a technical exercise30:05 Mottainai and the deeper meaning of waste32:25 Why lean tools were always socio-technical33:40 Kanban, standardized work, and the human side of lean35:10 The A3 as more than a problem-solving tool37:35 The most common failure mode in lean transformations38:30 When lean becomes the goal instead of the means39:30 Why lean isn’t just for executives40:35 Improving work at every level of the organization41:40 Why empowerment without support falls apart42:20 The Andon system as a model for real support43:45 Where do you need to grow: technical or human?
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  74 | What Problem Are We Solving? John Shook Reflects: Has Lean Failed? (Part 1 of 3) 13.05.2026 37min

  Has lean really failed?That question sparked one of the most listened-to conversations in the history of this podcast — my two-part series with Jim Womack in episodes 37 and 38.When I sat down with John Shook — one of the most influential thought leaders and practitioners in the global lean and continuous improvement community — we explored a different angle.John's perspective isn't a rebuttal. It's a reframe. A counterpoint to the question itself.John asks: what problem are we really trying to solve?His answer unfolds across three episodes — the first ever three-part series on Chain of Learning. And I think it will change how you think about your own impact as a change leader.You’ll Learn:Why the question "how many lean enterprises have we created?" may be leading us in the wrong direction — and what we should ask insteadThe difference between "command and control" and what John calls "command and abandon" — and which one you're more likely doingWhy the key question in problem-solving is not "is this accurate?" but "is this useful?"How to recognize your span of influence and build systems at the right level that help people think, learn, and take ownershipWhy purpose → work → capability is the right sequence — and why most leaders start in the wrong placeABOUT MY GUEST:John Shook spent eleven years with Toyota in Japan and the U.S., where he helped transfer the Toyota Production System globally. He later served as President of the Lean Enterprise Institute and Chairman of the Lean Global Network.John is the co-author of the award-winning books Learning to See and Managing to Learn, and wrote the foreword to my book Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn. As an industrial anthropologist, he brings a perspective that connects culture, systems, and practice to bridge deep thinking with real-world application.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/74Connect with John Shook: lean.org/about-lei/senior-advisors-staff/john-shook/ Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson Subscribe to my newsletter: kbjanderson.com/newsletterCheck out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.comJoin us on the Japan Leadership Experience: KBJAnderson.com/japantrip Grab a copy of, “Learning to Lead, Leading to Learn,”: kbjanderson.com/learning-to-lead TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:03:00 Why John Shook believes we may be asking the wrong question about lean05:25 Why change leadership always starts with changing yourself06:40 The tension between influencing others and trying to control them08:15 What a people-centered learning culture actually looks like in practice09:05 Why John avoids lean jargon and starts with the problem instead10:00 The Toyota question that shaped John’s thinking: “What problem are you trying to solve?”11:15 Why learning only matters when it’s grounded in the work12:30 Toyota’s “attitude toward learning” and why it changes everything15:05 Why leaders must create the environment for learning and problem-solving16:00 How organizations drift into “big company disease”17:05 Why purpose → work → capability is the sequence most leaders miss18:15 The risk of starting culture change with leadership behaviors alone19:20 Why focusing on the work reveals what’s really blocking change21:00 Why John sees more “command and abandon” than command and control23:20 Focusing on your span of influence instead of waiting for senior leaders27:15 How every person at work already has “problem consciousness”29:00 The surprising truth about who is most frustrated in organizations32:15 Building systems at your level that create ownership and capability33:20 Why modeling the behavior matters more than pushing harder36:15 Why sustainable change starts with how you show up each day
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  73 | Small Steps, Leading with Heart: How Transformation Sustains [with Richard Koch] 29.04.2026 46min

  The way you’re leading transformation might be getting in the way of the culture you’re trying to build.As change leaders and practitioners, we care about results. But in that focus, it’s easy to stay on the outer work—processes, metrics, systems—and underestimate the inner work – our mindset, behaviors, and relationships – that actually moves people.Our passion can unintentionally pull us away from creating the conditions for learning, alignment, and growth, and taking ownership back by stepping in to do, to solve, and to own the work.To explore this, I’m joined by Richard Koch, who has spent 25+ years leading change inside large, complex global organizations—from frontline improvement to system-level transformation. We’re connected by a shared belief: sustainable transformation doesn’t come from pushing harder. It comes from creating the conditions for people to be successful.In this conversation, Richard shares what he’s learned from being inside that tension including why the way many organizations deploy improvement teams can unintentionally prevent the problem-solving ownership they’re trying to build.You’ll Learn:Why daily work and small steps are where long-term change is actually builtHow separating leadership development and continuous improvement creates confusion—and weakens ownershipWhere improvement teams unintentionally take over the work and limit capability growthWhat it looks like to support leaders in owning change without stepping in to solve itWhy the leader must be at the center of transformation—and what changes when that responsibility is heldABOUT MY GUEST:Richard H. Koch is Managing Director of Serofia and works with leaders who want to create meaningful progress for people, performance, and the future they are helping to shape. Drawing on more than 25 years of international experience across strategy, leadership, operational excellence, innovation, and transformation, he brings together coaching, training, and consulting in a way that is both human and practical. His approach is grounded in systems thinking, deep listening, and helping leaders turn strategic ambition into real progress through small steps and real work.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/73Connect with Richard Koch: linkedin.com/in/richardkoch88Learn more about Serofia: serofia.comFollow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson Subscribe to my newsletter: kbjanderson.com/newsletterCheck out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.comTIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:03:44 Importance of seeing potential in every person06:10 How seemingly insignificant actions ripple through teams08:37 Why separating leadership and improvement work breaks progress09:14 The Inner System vs. Outer System framework and how it drives change12:19 The negative effect with silos that keeps you away from  focusing on the work and the leader15:14 Why forcing change undermines ownership17:32 The mindset shift for change leaders and internal consultants19:07 Why daily work is the path to long-term transformation 21:22 When improvement work splits into process and leadership, change stops sticking23:19 Why direct observation and connection matter25:23 Challenge of relying on experts to help solve problems28:27 How to build sustainability instead of dependency29:05 Navigating trust, timing, and influence with senior leaders32:25 Leading with empathy and understanding the pressure leaders are under33:52 Value of having the right outside partner to achieve goals35:50 Seeing a leader move from sponsor to truly owning and enabling change39:36 Importance of staying curious and creating space for ideas and growth41:00 Taking small steps to make big changes43:00 The essence of small steps, belief in people, and leading with heart to create the conditions for change
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  72 | Finding Clarity Through the Messy Middle: Reflections from My Book Retreat [with Betsy Jordyn] (BONUS) 22.04.2026 45min

  The messy middle is part of the learning process.It’s the point where what worked before no longer fully fits—but what comes next is not yet clear.Where your thinking is still forming, your ideas are evolving, and the answer has not fully emerged.And while it can feel uncertain, this is often where the deepest continuous learning happens.In this behind-the-scenes bonus episode on Chain of Learning, I share a live conversation with, Betsy Jordyn, my business coach and strategic thinking partner, recorded on the final day of a working retreat earlier this month. We pull back the curtains and invite you into our unscripted reflections from working through the messy middle of shaping my next book—and the leadership (and life) lessons that continue to emerge through the process.Tune in to hear the real-time learning, reflection, and refinement happening as I shape the ideas behind my next book.You’ll learn:Why the messy middle is often a necessary part of continuous learning, growth, and effective change leadershipHow to recognize when forcing clarity too early limits stronger thinking from emergingWhat it looks like to let ideas evolve instead of defending what came beforeHow collaboration and outside perspective sharpen your judgment and deepen your thinkingWhy modeling your own learning process creates stronger conditions for learning in othersHow to stay engaged in uncertainty without rushing to jumping to answers too quicklyABOUT MY GUEST:Betsy Jordyn is the founder and CEO of Betsy Jordyn International, a strategic branding firm that helps transformational consultants and coaches refine their messaging, positioning, and offers to accelerate their success and amplify their impact. She is also the host of the Consulting Matters podcast and a sought-after speaker and trainer on brand strategy, executive influence, and the business of transformation.Will you help me?I have a quick favor to ask. I’m conducting research for my next book and would love to get your insights on people-centered, learning organizations and the leadership that creates them. The survey takes just 5 to 10 minutes and your responses will directly shape the book and a future Chain of Learning podcast episode. -> Take the Survey here, open through May 22.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes: ChainOfLearning.com/72Connect with Betsy Jordyn: linkedin.com/in/betsy-jordynListen to Betsy’s Podcast, Consulting Matters: betsyjordyn.com/podcasts/consulting-matters Check out my website for resources and working together: KBJAnderson.comFollow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjanderson Download my FREE KATALYST™ Change Leader Self-Assessment: KBJAnderson.com/katalystSubscribe to my newsletter: kbjanderson.com/newsletter Take the People-Centered Leadership SurveyTIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:01:16 The hidden reality of creativity and why books are written multiple times02:39 What the messy middle feels like and why this stage matters more than we think05:04 Re-centering leadership on what’s within your control in a world of constant change06:00 Why influence isn’t about forcing change, but creating conditions for growth08:12 Reframing resistance and what people actually need to move forward10:06 How to keep evolving instead of staying stuck in old ways of thinking12:26 The process of writing a book and getting clarity on the what the book is about16:04 Why growth often requires releasing what once worked17:09 Benefits of collaborating in person vs. using AI as a thinking partner18:07 Why learning can’t be forced, but we need to allow space for insight22:07 The concept of omotenashi and looking at a lens of caring from a human angle24:14 The meaning of Intention = Heart + Direction to create the conditions for learning29:15 What changes when you respect others’ agency instead of driving direction32:19 How to have empathy and not push your agenda when leaders are not “bought in”33:01 Why your expertise can become a barrier to connection and clarity35:46 How different perspectives reveal whether your message actually lands38:08 Moving beyond the lingo to prevent barriers43:27 Why growth requires releasing identities, ideas, and ways of working
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  71 | Own the Thinking Process, Not the Thinking: How Leaders Build Problem-Solving Capability 15.04.2026 22min

  Caring becomes carrying.It happens so naturally we rarely notice it. Someone brings us a problem. We care. We want to help. And somewhere in that desire to help, without meaning to, we take on the weight of solving it ourselves.That shift is subtle. And costly.Because the moment you take ownership of the thinking, you take away the very capability you're trying to build.In this episode, I explore a critical shift in change leadership: how to hold the thinking process so others can solve their own problems — without taking on their work as your own.Your value as a leader isn't in having the answer. It's in creating the conditions where others can think, test, and learn. When you want to create empowered problem-solving in your organization, stepping back is stepping up.You'll Learn:How to notice when you've shifted from supporting someone's thinking to carrying their problemWhy redirecting your focus from the problem to the person working through it changes everything about how you coachHow to use a simple problem solving structure (Target, Actual, Gap) to anchor your questions and keep ownership where it belongsHow to stay present to how someone is thinking instead of jumping ahead to solutionsHow to choose intentionally when to step in with direction — and when to step back to build capabilityIMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes with links to other podcast episodes and resources: ChainOfLearning.com/71 Check out my website for resources and ways to work with me KBJAnderson.comFollow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjandersonDownload my free KATALYST™ Change Leader Self-Assessment: KBJAnderson.com/katalyst TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:00:40 The subtle shift from caring to carrying problem solving03:35 Realization of owning the process of solving the problem04:39 What gets in the way of intentions to be helpful05:27 Why problem solving and problem solving coaching are two different skills05:50 How to stay focused on the thinking process and keep from sliding back into the problem itself06:42 How to anchor questions around a structured problem solving flow08:11 The mantra, “Target, Actual gap, Please explain,” to identify the real problem before jumping to solutions09:13 Benefit of assigning a problem for a team member to solve10:56 The identity shift from having all the answers to holding the process12:28 One way to notice if you have a telling habit14:41 Why you should avoid defaulting to giving the answer and ask questions to understand the problem first16:59 The meaning of intention = heart + direction to coach with the right motives17:21 Three steps to coach with intention:17:25 [ONE] Take an intention pause17:45 [TWO] Choose the behaviors that align with that impact18:08 [THREE] Reflect and learn your way forward19:15 Positive result from leading by asking questions that helped team gain confidence21:41 Three reflection questions before you go into your next coaching conversation
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  70| Talk to the People: How Leaders Make Better Decisions [with Nigel Thurlow] 01.04.2026 49min

  What happens when leaders make decisions further and further away from the work itself?In a world of AI, automated dashboards, and remote work, it’s easy to manage representations of work instead of understanding what’s actually happening for the people who do it.Yet, when leaders rely on data rather than facts, they often end up solving the wrong problems, even with the best intentions.In this episode of Chain of Learning, I'm joined by Nigel Thurlow, consultant, systems thinker, and Toyota's first-ever Chief of Agile, to explore how better decisions come from understanding how the system actually operates. And that understanding is built by engaging with the people doing the work.When you stay connected, you don't just get better information. You see how work actually flows, where problems emerge, and what's getting in the way. You build trust, surface issues earlier, and make it easier for people to think and solve problems together.In this episode, you’ll learn:Why there's a critical difference between delegation and empowerment — and why one leaves people unable to actHow to distinguish between data and facts, and why going to see conditions firsthand changes the decisions you makeWhat "going to gemba" looks like in a digital or remote environment when there's no factory floor to walkWhy making work visible creates the conditions for people to surface problems,  before they compoundWhy AI amplifies what's already there — and why fixing the underlying system comes firstABOUT MY GUEST: Nigel Thurlow is CEO of The Flow Consortium and the creator of Scrum the Toyota Way. He spent over 20 years at Toyota, including serving as the first Chief of Agile at Toyota Connected. He is co-author of The Flow System and The Flow System Playbook, and his work focuses on improving decision-making in complex environments.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes with links to other podcast episodes and resources: ChainOfLearning.com/70 Check out my website for resources and ways to work with me KBJAnderson.comConnect with Nigel Thurlow: linkedin.com/in/nigelthurlowFollow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjandersonDownload my free KATALYST™ Change Leader Self-Assessment: KBJAnderson.com/katalyst  TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:03:19 Effects of being detached from the work when working remotely04:17 Difference between delegation and empowerment when assigning work to others05:35 Fear of those who are delegated to of failing or making the wrong decision07:15 What it means to empower someone and transfer the ownership of that decision to someone else09:21 How to go to gemba and go where the work is done10:07 The benefits of "presenteeism" and being present where the work is performed11:46 Benefits of collaborating in person vs. a digital environment to make better decision13:02 Nigel’s experience in working in a frozen food manufacturer and going out to the line to understand the pain workers experienced15:42 Why you need to understand how work gets done to improve throughput and quality of work16:39 Benefits of hiring an external or internal consultant to understand the problems that need solving19:31 The effects of companies investing in tools and AI and realizing it doesn’t help with problem solving21:30 How to avoid the leadership decision problem and get all the facts to avoid consequences24:39 Technique known as “sense making” to understand the temperament and behaviors in the environment to reveal dark constraints26:09 The difference between US and Toyota’s corporate culture in incentivizing leaders to be part of a system29:10 How to help workers make changes that need to be made visible to senior leaders35:04 Enabling others to communicate with leaders to improve decision making37:14 Why badly designed systems and not the workforce are the cause of problems38:25 Why you can’t implement AI with a broken system40:31 The possible future of AI and how it can affect our decision making43:37 Importance of embracing the human connection to better communicate and make better decisions47:24 Reflect on where your decisions may be happening too far from the work
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  69| Better Judgment, Not Better AI Tools: What Leaders Need to Learn and Unlearn [with Barry O'Reilly] 18.03.2026 45min

  You're being told to use AI. But which tool you actually need to do your best work?Leaders and change practitioners everywhere feel the same pressures right now — more meetings, more information, more mandates to adopt AI — with less time to think and less clarity about where to start. And most of the advice begins in the wrong place: with the tool.In this episode of Chain of Learning, I talk with Barry O'Reilly, bestselling author of Unlearn and Lean Enterprise, and author of the new book Artificial Organizations, about why the real opportunity with AI isn't automation. It's better judgment.Barry shares examples from his work with Fortune 500 executives who are successfully pairing human instinct with machine insight — not by adopting every new tool, but by understanding how they work, where judgment matters most, and what needs to be unlearned along the way. It's about letting go of the belief that your expertise is your competitive advantage, and starting to see AI not as a replacement, but as a thinking partner that can sharpen your clarity, your presence, and your preparation.In this episode, you'll learn:Why starting with the tool is the wrong place to start — and what to do insteadHow to identify your natural traits and highest-leverage tasks as the foundation for working with AIThe unlearning required to shift from relying on instinct alone to combining human judgment with machine insightHow successful leaders are using AI to pressure-test ideas and show up more prepared and presentWhy the skills that make you more effective with AI are the same skills that make you more influential with peopleWhere does judgment matter most in your role right now — and what might you need to unlearn to create space for a better way of working?ABOUT MY GUEST: Barry O'Reilly is the bestselling author of Unlearn and co-author of Lean Enterprise. He hosts the Unlearn Podcast and is co-founder of Nobody Studios, an AI-driven venture studio. His newest book, Artificial Organizations, is a practical guide for leaders ready to combine human and machine intelligence to make better decisions faster. Barry O’Reilly is also giving away a copy of Artificial Organizations to THREE lucky winners!Artificial Organizations explores how leaders can combine human judgment with AI to make better decisions in an increasingly complex world. Instead of focusing on AI tools, the book shows how organizations must redesign how leaders think, work, and make decisions so technology enhances clarity rather than amplifies confusion. It presents a practical leadership system for using AI as a thinking partner to improve judgment, reduce decision overload, and lead more effectively.Register now to enter the giveaway!IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes with links to other podcast episodes and resources: ChainOfLearning.com/69 Check out my website for resources and ways to work with me KBJAnderson.comConnect with Barry O’Reilly: linkedin.com/in/barryoreilly Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjandersonCheck out Barry O’Reilly’s book, Artificial Organizations: artificialorganizations.com Subscribe to my newsletter: kbjanderson.com/newsletter Learn more about my coaching, trusted advisor partnerships, and leadership learning experiences: organizations@kbjanderson.com RELATED LINKS:Unlearn Podcast | Intentional Leadership with Katie AndersonEpisode 59 | Get Better at Getting Better: Leveraging AI to Elevate Human Learning with Nathen HarveyTIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:02:28 Where to start on adopting AI05:04 Importance of understanding natural traits and strengths before looking into AI tools07:12 Defining the problem first before looking for the tool to close the gap08:17 Why some may see AI as a deflection tool09:02 How to use AI for synthesizing data rather than rudimentary tasks12:28 Why judgment is the leadership advantage and leveraging AI to make better judgment12:38 Using decision velocity to improve decision making13:35 Decision advantage in synthesizing data to make a decision14:35 The difference between AI and human strengths in decision making16:26 Unlearning how you work to make progress19:32 Why human thinking plus machine equals a better outcome20:28 Examples of how to use AI to be the best business and thinking partner24:46 Importance of asking the right questions when brainstorming with AI26:06 The limitations of AI and knowing how to use it to your advantage30:18 How technology can help us be make a bigger impact33:12 The loss of psychological safety when implementing AI and unlearning this fear35:35 Better results when teams collaborate with AI vs. doing it independently36:06 Shifting from control based learning mindset to influence based learning mindset for continuous improvement37:54 Implementing AI to be the most effective in your organization40:34 How to start building an AI stack knowing your natural traits, one or two tasks, and then experimenting with an AI tool42:54 The skills that make us more effective with machines to increase influence43:16 Questions for reflection on how to implement AI in your organization
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  68| The Power of Learning Together: How Shared Experience Enables People-Centered Leadership 11.03.2026 23min

  What changes when leaders stop learning alone—and start learning together?Leadership development often focuses on individual insight: reading, listening, reflecting. But some of the most meaningful shifts in leadership don’t happen that way.They happen when leadership teams go see, ask questions, and reflect together.That shared experience becomes a catalyst—aligning leaders around a new way of seeing their organization, supporting one another in practicing new behaviors, and driving lasting transformation.In this episode of Chain of Learning, you’ll learn why immersive experiences can transform how leadership teams align, learn, and develop—and why learning in context often leads to change that lasts.Drawing on examples from my Japan Leadership Experience, we look at what happens when leadership teams step away from the day-to-day pressures of their roles and create space to learn and reflect in new ways.Shared experiences give leadership teams something powerful: a common reference point for how they want to lead and improve—accelerating organizational transformation.In this episode, we explore how to:Shift from learning as an individual activity to learning as a leadership team practiceCreate alignment by seeing and reflecting on the same thingsMove from “What did I learn?” to “What are we seeing differently?”Turn shared insights into new leadership behaviors back at workUnderstand why immersion and context matter when developing people-centered leadershipIMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes with links to other podcast episodes and resources: ChainOfLearning.com/67 Check out my website for resources and ways to work with me KBJAnderson.comFollow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjandersonDownload my free KATALYST™ Change Leader Self-Assessment: KBJAnderson.com/katalyst Learn more about my Japan Leadership Experience: kbjanderson.com/japantripRELATED EPISODES:Episode 25 | Getting Results Through the Power of Serious Leadership with Kecia Kelly and Amy ChaumetonEpisode 20 | How to Coach Executives and Influence Change with Brad ToussaintEpisode 48 | Make Leadership Meaningful: From Tools to Purposeful Impact with Josef ProcházkaEpisode 67 | Why Lifelong Learning Is the Foundation of Influence (and Can Limit Your Impact)Episode 4 | Leading for Impact: The Power of Being Over DoingEpisode 17 | Leading Change from the Middle with Pennie SaumTIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:1:30 The gap between inspiration and the system you return to2:46  Three conditions that most leadership development is missing.4:13 The fundamental difference when others are learning beside you vs. learning alone4:47 How Jim, Healthcare COO,  accelerated transformation by inviting his team on the Japan Leadership Experience6:49 Transformations that past Japan Leadership Experience have experienced in accelerated learning and sustaining excellence in their organization10:34 Unlocking shoshin - the beginner’s mind - through immersive experiences12:04 The benefits of observing Japan employees and companies in person14:22 The depth of connection that forms when you learn together16:43 Why shared learning is important for leaders to make changes that sticks18:55 The cultural impact of the Japan Leadership Experience21:31 The deepest leadership changes that come from shared learning and shared leadership
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  67| Why Learning Is the Foundation of Influence (and How it Can Limit Your Impact) 04.03.2026 22min

  What if your approach to learning is actually limiting your influence as a change leader?Many of us pride ourselves on being lifelong learners. We read, earn certifications, study new tools, and go deep into our methodology. That depth is a strength. But as your responsibility grows—from running projects to shaping transformation—what’s required of you changes.At some point, going deeper into your method or functional expertise is no longer enough. Your role shifts from applying tools to enabling leaders to see the whole system, define the real problem before choosing an approach.In this episode of Chain of Learning, I help you learn how to move from learning as accumulation to learning as adaptable influence.As your scope expands, you’re no longer just responsible for executing well. You’re responsible for how others think, decide, and take ownership. That requires more than expertise. It requires the ability to step back, question the form, and respond to what the situation truly calls for.We often define learning as going deeper into an area of expertise, but what can be missing is a shift toward adaptability and broader perspective. A learning and growth mindset is the foundation for enabling a learning organization—yet if you get attached to one form or method, it can constrain your influence.In this episode, you’ll explore how to:Describe the impact you create tools or jargonMove from Shuhari—rigidly following a method to adapting based on contextPractice beginner’s mind—Shoshin, even when you’re the expertIdentify when you’ve fallen into the Doer Trap—and choose to develop others insteadNotice when you’re following the form in situations that call for flexibilityIf you want to build a learning organization, your own learning approach must evolve first. It’s not just what you know, but how you show up.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes with links to other podcast episodes and resources: ChainOfLearning.com/67 Check out my website for resources and ways to work with me KBJAnderson.comFollow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjandersonDownload my free KATALYST™ Change Leader Self-Assessment: KBJAnderson.com/katalyst Learn more about my Japan Leadership Experience: kbjanderson.com/japantripRELATED EPISODES:Episode 65 | From Learning to Impact: Turn Insight into Leadership ActionEpisode 9 | The 8 Essential Skills to Become a Transformational Change Katalyst™Episode 15 | 5 Steps to Revitalize Lifelong LearningEpisode 27 | 3 Practices to Become a Skillful FacilitatorEpisode 42 | Do the Right Thing: Japanese Management Masterclass Part 1 with Tim WolputEpisode 52 | What You Love About Lean and Operational Excellence — And Your #1 Frustration: How to Get Executive Buy-inTIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:00:40 The Katalyst model revision and why lifelong learning was removed as a standalone competency03:24 Why learning isn't what distinguishes your influence. It's what makes influence possible05:07 What it means to be a lifelong learning enthusiast06:52 Three questions every change leader should be able to answer without jargon09:22 What 75 leaders revealed in a survey and the lesson underneath it10:31 The concept of Shu Ha Ri that shapes how you develop and learn:11:13 [SHU] following the form11:25 [HA] where you begin to adapt11:35 [RI] Transcending the form entirely12:20 Five Toyota Kata Coaching questions developed by Mike Roth that requires learning and unlearning to develop, grow, and improve15:05 The concept of Shoshin and clearing what's in the way16:04 Katie's personal confession about her own telling habit and what modeling the way actually looks like in practice17:35 The "doer trap" and why getting leadership buy-in starts with us20:39 What lifelong learning really means and why it’s a being practice21:01 Three practices to try this week to create more impact
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  66| Leadership Is Practice: What It Takes to Lead Transformation as Responsibility Grows [with Carlos Scholz] 18.02.2026 1h 3min

  What does it really take to lead transformation as responsibility grows?At some point, leadership stops being about doing the improvement work or having the right answers. For operational leaders and change practitioners alike, the work moves to holding the system—people, priorities, and consequences—and helping others learn how to do the same.In this episode of Chain of Learning, I’m joined by Carlos Scholz, CEO of Catalysis, to explore the critical shift leaders must make to enable systemic, lasting organizational change.Carlos shares his journey from technically trained engineer in manufacturing, to transformational change leader in healthcare leading a team of continuous improvement practitioners, to operations leader, and now CEO. Across these roles, he’s learned that transformation doesn’t fail because leaders don’t care or aren’t trying, but because we often rush to outcomes and skip the systems-level and behavioral maturity required to sustain them.This conversation highlights a critical truth: leadership is practice. It’s not a role or a title, it’s how you intentionally show up and get better, day after day.Together, we explore what really changes as leadership responsibility and organizational complexity increase, how leaders have to change their own behavior, and how influence shifts when the work is no longer about doing improvement, but about developing leaders who can own the system.In this episode, we explore:Why leadership becomes less about expertise and more about intentional practice as scope and responsibility expandWhat changes when you move from leading through influence to owning the system through positional authority and the consequences that come with itHow identity and perceived value shape resistance to change, including your ownWhy skipping organizational and behavioral maturity undermines reliability, even with strong intentionsHow repositioning improvement teams from doers to coaches helps leaders change their behavior and allows transformation to scaleIf you’re navigating your own growth as a change leader—or supporting leaders in truly owning their system—this conversation offers language and perspective to help you lead with greater impact.ABOUT MY GUEST:Carlos Scholz is the CEO of Catalysis, a mission-driven organization advancing people-centered, value-based healthcare. A former manufacturing engineer and healthcare operations and change leader at Kaiser Permanente and NYC Health + Hospitals, he brings deep experience driving system-wide Lean and continuous improvement transformation and developing leaders at scale. Carlos was named a Shingo Rising Star and serves on the Shingo Institute Board.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes with links to other podcast episodes and resources: ChainOfLearning.com/66 Check out my website for resources and ways to work with me KBJAnderson.comConnect with Carlos Scholz: linkedin.com/in/carlosscholz Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjandersonDownload my free KATALYST™ Change Leader Self-Assessment: KBJAnderson.com/katalyst Learn more about my Japan Leadership Experience: kbjanderson.com/japantripRELATED EPISODES:Episode 9 | Move from Technical Expert to Influential LeaderEpisode 16 | Leverage Analytical Systems Thinking and Psychological Safety to Drive Organizational Improvement [with Mark Graban]TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:03:02 Leadership shifts Carlos made stepping into senior executive responsibility06:19 The start of Carlos’ journey and how it evolvedrelationships as it does on technical expertise12:19 Learning that sustainable change depends as much on influence and being vulnerable and sharing openly 17:42 Multiple approaches in creating conditions for leaders to feel safe enough to be vulnerable18:44 Importance of organizational assessment to identify behavioral gaps24:05 Understanding that sustainable change requires aligning the entire system, not just improving isolated parts26:32 When leaders are not on board with change efforts28:48 Importance of both the technical and social side of being a change leader31:30 The process of building a system of coaching36:23 Transitioning from leading through influence to stepping into direct operational leadership43:28 How skills developed as an influence leader strengthened operational leadership45:57 A surprising lesson from stepping into an operational leadership role50:16 How Carlos is leading transformation as a CEO of Catalysis55:08 Steps to make real transformation happen1:00:13 Reminders for leading transformational change1:01:43 Questions for reflection to strengthen the system around you
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  65| From Learning to Impact: Turn Insight into Leadership Action 04.02.2026 23min

  What if the reason your learning feels productive—but your impact feels stuck—has nothing to do with effort?Many change leaders and improvement practitioners are excellent learners. You’re likely a Learning Enthusiast—like me. You read the books, attend the workshops, listen to podcasts, and gather ideas with genuine enthusiasm.And yet, despite all that effort, learning doesn’t always turn into impact. In fact, it can sometimes lead to overwhelm or paralysis—more ideas, more options, and less clarity about what to actually do.I’ve lived this pattern myself, and I see it again and again in my work with leaders around the world. When learning becomes something we collect rather than something we practice—and bring to fruition through our habits—it stalls our impact.The challenge isn’t gaining more knowledge.It’s learning how to turn insight into behavior—and connect behavior to results.In this episode, I explore a critical shift: moving from the Chain of Learning® to a Chain of Impact.Instead of treating continuous learning as something to acquire, I invite you to see learning as something to harvest—by making the value chain of impact explicit: turning insight into specific behaviors, practicing them deliberately through doing and reflection, and connecting that practice to the impact it creates for people and results.If you care deeply about learning, growth, and people—and want to build the capability to translate learning into action and impact—this episode will help you do exactly that.YOU’LL LEARNHow to recognize when learning feels productive but isn’t changing how you actually show up as a leaderHow to make the connection between learning, behavior, and impact visible—and actionableWhy behaviors—not intentions, traits, or inspiration—are the real bridge between learning and resultsHow treating leadership actions as experiments helps you learn by doing and reflection, not just aiming for a targetWhy harvesting learning means finishing what’s ready—not endlessly adding more ideas or initiativesIMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes with links to other podcast episodes and resources: ChainOfLearning.com/65 Check out my website for resources and ways to work with me KBJAnderson.comDownload my free KATALYST™ Change Leader Self-Assessment: KBJAnderson.com/katalyst Learn more about my Japan Leadership Experience: kbjanderson.com/japantripTIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:00:59 Why doing more is not mean progress02:13 The invisible trap of when we are focused on learning vs. putting it into practice02:27 Harvest - what it means and why it’s a fitting word for 2026 05:04 The difference between learning and behavior in creating impact05:25 How to apply Intention = Heart + Direction® to close the execution gap07:40 Four key practices to take action on learning to impact your work and life 07:48 [ONE] Make the learning itself concrete and specific09:00 [TWO] Focus on specific observable behaviors, not traits that we want to develop10:48 [THREE] Identify the gap you want to close and identify what you expect to happen and the impact when you put the learning into practice11:42 [FOUR] Reflect and adjust for accelerated improvement12:49 Where intention stems from and why intention plus direction is important to see results13:54 How leaders turn into impact through the Immersive Japan Leadership Experience14:52 Three open ended questions for leaders to reflect on to create a clear action plan17:07 Josef’s experience in shifting from being seen as an expert to a trusted partner18:06 Questions to ask to help break the telling habit21:12 How the meaning of “harvest” is focused on collaboration and creating the space for others to grow22:40 Reflection questions to reflect on to make an impact through your behaviorP.S. This episode happens to be released on my birthday 🎉 If Chain of Learning has made a difference for you, a quick rating and review would mean a lot—and helps others discover the show. Leave a rating and review on Apple Podcasts or rating and comments on an episode on Spotify or YouTube.
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  64| Stop Doing Transformation—and Start Enabling It: Redefine Your Role as a Change Leader [with Jill Forrester] 21.01.2026 45min

  What if the reason leading your organization’s transformation feels heavy isn’t the work itself—but the role you’ve been playing as a change leader?If you’re a change leader, continuous improvement professional, or internal consultant, this tension may feel familiar. You’re helping. You’re busy. You’re delivering results. And before you realize it, you’re wearing every hat—facilitator, teacher, problem-solver, checker—all at once.That was my experience too as an internal change leader. And it’s a pattern I see again and again in my work with internal change leaders and continuous improvement practitioners: when we’re not clear on our role, we become the doers of transformation—when our real work is to enable others to lead it.In this episode of Chain of Learning, I’m joined by Jill Forrester, Director of Continuous Improvement at 3sHealth, to explore the leadership shift that changed how she and her team show up—and the impact they’re having—by moving from helping to intentionally creating the conditions for learning and ownership.If you’ve ever felt the weight of carrying organizational transformation on your shoulders, this conversation will help you see why—and how redefining your role and how you help can change everything.You’ll LearnWhy internal change leaders often become the default doers—and why that role isn’t sustainableHow lack of role clarity creates confusion, overburden, and dependency for leaders and their internal clientsWhat it really means to create the experience for learning, not just drive improvement outcomesWhy clarifying and labeling your role and intention changes how others engageHow shifting from doing to enabling builds capability, ownership, and sustainable transformationABOUT MY GUEST:Jill Forrester has been a leader in health system transformation since 2012. She has collaboratively guided the development of a comprehensive management system at 3sHealth, encompassing patient and customer engagement, problem-solving and process redesign, strategic visioning and deployment, performance measurement, leadership coaching and development, and employee engagement. Jill is an active member of a strong provincial network of continuous quality improvement leaders dedicated to strengthening Saskatchewan’s health system through learning-centered, people-focused practices.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes with links to other podcast episodes and resources: ChainOfLearning.com/64 Check out my website for resources and ways to work with me KBJAnderson.comConnect with Jill Forrester: linkedin.com/in/jill-forrester Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjandersonDownload my free KATALYST™ Change Leader Self-Assessment: KBJAnderson.com/katalyst Learn more about my Japan Leadership Experience: kbjanderson.com/japantripDiscover how to get out of the Doer Trap: kbjanderson.com/doertrap TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:03:27 Jill’s new role director of continuous improvement and when she realized she needed to make a shift05:00 The question, “Are we actually helping”?  that changed how Jill viewed her role07:01 Why starting a training with questions makes a bigger impact10:12 Why opening up space for others to learn and contribute can improve engagement13:56 Two shifts Jill and her team made to clarify their roles for better continuous improvement outcomes and build confidence16:07 Labeling your role (even when it feels awkward) to better guide others to transformation22:47 What lead Jill to invest in the Japan Leadership Experience to take her leadership to the next level25:14 Seeing quality as trust and quality as love to reshape how you think about improvement25:44 What good 5S is as something you feel instead of a checklist27:16 An example of 5S in the Japanese culture29:20 The importance of long term thinking to sustain your company for decades30:42 How giving with two hands can be applied to your organization to show respect and support others33:08 The impact of creating space for others to ask questions and learn more quickly35:05 Doing less doing and creating the conditions to increase results and coach more effectively37:15 Reflections to shift from doers to catalysts of change 38:29 Top recommendation for change leaders and continuous improvement practitioners who want to show up in that different space from doing to enabling40:35 Your role as a change leader and creating an experience for others to learn and to lead change themselves42:38 The impact of an intention pause before your next meeting or discussion to help you shift from doing to enabling
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  63| Close the Execution Gap: How Leaders Turn Sustainability Intent into Action [with Rose Heathcote] 07.01.2026 39min

  Many major transformations, including lean and sustainability—don’t stall because leaders don’t care. They stall because of an execution gap: the gap between what organizations say matters and what actually shows up in daily work, decisions, and priorities.When you hear the word sustainability, what comes to mind first?If it’s recycling, you’re not alone. But sustainability is far bigger—and more complex—than end-point solutions that address the symptoms of deeper problems. As this episode reveals, sustainability efforts—are stuck in the execution gap between intent and action.In this episode of Chain of Learning, I’m joined by Rose Heathcote, sustainability expert, lean adviser, and author, to explore sustainability as a leadership and transformation challenge, not just an environmental one.Together, we discuss why sustainability often lives in strategy decks and slogans, but struggles to take root in everyday work, and how leaders can shift their focus upstream to close that gap: to how work is designed, how problems are framed, and how people learn to see new kinds of waste and impact.This conversation goes beyond sustainability to address a pattern that shows up in any transformation—lean, AI-enabled change, or building a people-first learning organization. If you’re working to close the gap between intention and execution, this episode offers perspective and practical starting points for leading meaningful change that lasts.You’ll Learn:What sustainability really means—and why it’s often treated as an aspiration instead of embedded in daily workWhat the sustainability execution gap is, and why it mirrors lean and culture-change failuresWhy shifting problem-solving upstream—from symptoms to root causes—is critical for creating lasting impactHow lean thinking and problem-solving skills enable sustainability and organizational transformation when paired with influence and change leadership skillsWhy speaking the language of business matters for gaining leadership buy-in—and how AI can be used as a thinking partner to support systems thinking and better decisionsABOUT MY GUEST:Rose Heathcote is a speaker, adviser, and Chartered Environmentalist who works at the intersection of Lean thinking and sustainability. She is the founder of Thinking People and the author of "Green Is the New Gold." With decades of experience supporting organizations across industries and regions, Rose focuses on helping leaders move sustainability from aspiration to everyday practice through systems thinking, problem-solving, and people-centered change.IMPORTANT LINKS:Full episode show notes with links to other podcast episodes and resources: ChainOfLearning.com/63 Check out my website for resources and ways to work with me KBJAnderson.comConnect with Rose Heathcote: linkedin.com/in/rose-heathcote Follow me on LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/kbjandersonDownload my free KATALYST™ Change Leader Self-Assessment: KBJAnderson.com/katalyst Learn more about Rose’s book, “Green is the New Gold”: https://payhip.com/b/UtreTLearn more about my Japan Leadership Experience: kbjanderson.com/japantrip TIMESTAMPS FOR THIS EPISODE:01:04 Why the real challenge with sustainability starts with where the conversation begins02:39 A broader definition of sustainability meeting the needs of people, planet, and future generations04:16 Why people mistake sustainability for “recycling”05:54 The execution gap lean leaders keep running into07:43 A real-world example: when “people first” and sustainability don’t show up in the metrics09:58 Important shifts leaders must make to close the execution gap11:26 Seeing waste, energy loss, and impact through a green lens14:06 Using AI as a thinking partner, not a replacement15:16 The skills leaders must develop in an AI-driven world16:41 How multidisciplinary thinking led to a smarter, more sustainable solution19:19 Why sustainability requires systems thinking across the value chain20:23 How to make progress towards big challenges23:05 The meaning of the Japanese concept, “sanpo yori” and “yanpo yori” for goodness in four ways and happiness for the long term view24:33 How the book “Green is the New Gold,” came to be27:10 Three ways to build better products and be more efficient while reducing impacts on the planet29:19 What we are doing well as a global community to make improvements towards sustainability31:31 How to broaden your lens and use what you already know to do more good32:35 Practical first steps lean leaders can take to apply a sustainability lens at work34:29 Why productivity alone doesn’t reduce damage to the environment36:45 A simple reflection on looking upstream to improve sustainability