Counsel to Counsel - Career Advice for Lawyers

Episodes

• 
  Episode 186: Building a Law Practice by Design, Not by Default with Susan Guthrie 26.10.2026 44m

  What if you could start your law practice all over again? Would you build it the same way? Many lawyers build successful practices without ever consciously deciding what they want those practices to look like. They inherit systems from previous employers, follow traditional approaches to billing and marketing, and develop habits that may not serve their clients or their own professional satisfaction. My guest on this episode of Counsel to Counsel is Susan Guthrie, a nationally recognized attorney, mediator, practice-building strategist, and past chair of the American Bar Association Section of Dispute Resolution. Susan and I have gotten to know each other over the past year through our overlapping work coaching lawyers, our involvement with the ABA, and our shared interest in helping legal professionals build more satisfying and successful careers. I've been particularly impressed by Susan's generosity and her commitment to the concept of "coopetition," the idea that we all benefit when we support one another, even when our work overlaps. Susan is the creator of The Practice Playbook Series, including the recently released second edition of The Business Plan Playbook: A Step-by-Step Guide to Intentional Practice Design for Lawyers and Dispute Resolution Professionals. Her forthcoming ABA book, Future-Proof: How to Build a Thriving, AI-Ready Legal and Dispute Resolution Practice, explores how artificial intelligence, generational change, and evolving client expectations are reshaping the profession. In our conversation, Susan shares her own career journey from family law litigation to mediation and practice development consulting. We discuss why lawyers often build their practices by default rather than by design, how to rethink inherited systems and assumptions, and why intentional practice design can lead to greater professional satisfaction. We also explore the three forces Susan believes will fundamentally reshape legal practice over the next several years: AI, generational turnover, and changing client expectations. We discuss what those changes mean for hourly billing, the value lawyers provide to clients, and the skills professionals will need to remain competitive. Throughout our conversation, Susan emphasizes that insight alone isn't enough. Lawyers need practical strategies for implementing change and building practices that can evolve as their careers and the profession change. Whether you're launching your own practice, rethinking an established one, or wondering how to prepare for the future of law, Susan offers valuable perspectives on creating a practice that works for you rather than simply continuing along a path you never consciously chose. Key Takeaways Build your practice by design, not by default. Many lawyers inherit systems, processes, and assumptions from previous employers without considering whether those approaches fit their own goals. Intentional practice design begins by examining what you want from your practice and making deliberate choices about how to build it. You don't have to abandon everything you've learned. Susan distinguishes between inherited, reactive, and intentional elements of a practice. Existing systems may have real value, but lawyers should examine them critically and make changes where necessary rather than simply continuing to do things because that's how they've always been done. A business plan should be a living document. Susan's concept of a Living Practice Plan goes beyond the traditional business plan. Rather than creating a document that sits on a shelf, lawyers can develop a framework that guides everyday decisions about clients, services, pricing, marketing, and professional priorities. Professional involvement creates opportunities. Susan's experience with the American Bar Association demonstrates the value of showing up, volunteering, and becoming actively involved in professional organizations. Those relationships and opportunities can lead to unexpected career developments. Three major forces are reshaping the legal profession. Artificial intelligence, generational turnover, and changing client expectations are converging to transform how lawyers work, how clients engage legal professionals, and what younger generations expect from their careers. AI is changing what clients are paying for. As technology makes legal work more efficient, traditional hourly billing becomes harder to justify. Susan argues that lawyers will increasingly need to emphasize the value of their judgment, experience, strategic thinking, and professional expertise rather than the amount of time they spend completing tasks. Implementation matters more than inspiration. Lawyers can attend webinars, read books, and collect good ideas without changing anything about their practices. Susan emphasizes taking concrete steps to implement what you've learned and making incremental improvements that build toward a more satisfying and sustainable practice. In This Episode 02:56 – Susan's career journey from family law litigation to mediation and practice development 05:40 – How involvement in the ABA creates relationships and career opportunities 12:17 – What it means to build a law practice by design rather than by default 15:48 – Learning from inherited systems while developing your own approach to practice 21:13 – The Business Plan Playbook, intentional practice design, and the Living Practice Plan 28:31 – How AI, generational change, and evolving client expectations are transforming the legal profession 33:52 – The future of hourly billing and why lawyers need to communicate their value differently 38:01 – Turning ideas into action and preparing your practice for the future
• 
  Episode 185: Why Lawyers Resist AI and How Law Firms Can Overcome It, with Dr. Gleb Tsipursky 12.10.2026 44m

  Artificial intelligence is changing the practice of law. Lawyers are increasingly using AI for legal research, drafting, business development, and a growing number of other tasks. But while some lawyers are enthusiastically embracing these tools, others remain skeptical, concerned about confidentiality and accuracy, or worried about what AI will mean for their careers. My guest on this episode of Counsel to Counsel is Dr. Gleb Tsipursky, a behavioral scientist and CEO of Disaster Avoidance Experts, a consultancy focused on the future of work. His new book, The Psychology of AI Adoption at Work: From Resistance to Results, published by Georgetown University Press, explores why organizations struggle to get employees to adopt AI and what leaders can do about it. Gleb argues that successful AI adoption is not primarily a technology problem. It's a human problem involving psychology, trust, organizational culture, and leadership. This is particularly relevant to law firms, where lawyers are trained to be skeptical, question assumptions, and identify risks. But as Gleb explains, skepticism itself isn't necessarily the biggest obstacle. He identifies three psychological barriers that can interfere with AI adoption: fear of job loss, threats to professional identity, and the shame or stigma some lawyers associate with using AI. We discuss why traditional approaches to technology implementation may not work with AI, how law firm leaders can encourage experimentation and overcome resistance, and why effective training needs to focus on tasks lawyers actually want to improve. We also explore the importance of developing AI skills alongside legal expertise, how AI may change the economics and staffing of law firms, and why communication, empathy, and client relationships may become even more important as technology advances. For lawyers and law firm leaders wondering how to navigate these changes, Gleb offers practical advice about making AI adoption less threatening, more useful, and more likely to succeed. Key Takeaways AI adoption is fundamentally a people problem. Unlike traditional software implementations, successful AI adoption requires lawyers to be motivated and engaged rather than simply following standardized procedures. Law firms need to address the psychological and cultural barriers that prevent people from experimenting with these tools. Three psychological barriers explain much of the resistance. Gleb identifies lawyers who fear AI will eliminate their jobs, experienced lawyers who feel their professional identity is threatened, and lawyers who use AI but are reluctant to admit it because of social stigma. Each group requires a different leadership response. Skepticism can actually be an advantage. Although lawyers are trained to question assumptions and identify risks, Gleb argues that these traits can make them better AI users because they are more likely to evaluate the accuracy and reliability of AI-generated work. Better AI results require better instructions. Lawyers who are disappointed with AI-generated work may not be providing sufficient context, information, or direction. Gleb suggests treating AI like a capable but inexperienced assistant who needs detailed instructions and whose work must be reviewed. Start with tasks lawyers don't enjoy. Rather than forcing lawyers to use AI for their most sophisticated legal work, firms can build enthusiasm by demonstrating how AI can reduce time spent on emails, invoicing, and other routine activities. Training is more effective when lawyers leave with tools they can immediately use. Law firm leaders need to model AI adoption. Managing partners and practice leaders can reduce resistance by openly discussing how they use AI, encouraging lawyers to share successful applications, and creating an environment where experimentation and learning are supported. Legal expertise combined with AI skills will become increasingly valuable. As AI changes how legal services are delivered, lawyers will need to develop their technological capabilities while strengthening the judgment, communication, empathy, and client relationship skills that distinguish their services from what technology alone can provide. In This Episode 01:39 – Dr. Gleb Tsipursky's background in behavioral science and organizational decision-making 04:58 – Why AI adoption is a psychological and cultural challenge 10:07 – The three psychological barriers that prevent lawyers from embracing AI 16:13 – Why AI produces poor results and how better prompting can improve outcomes 20:48 – How law firm leaders can address fear, resistance, and stigma 28:46 – Making AI training practical and relevant to lawyers' daily work 33:51 – The skills lawyers will need to remain competitive in an AI-driven profession 35:51 – Three steps law firm leaders can take to improve AI adoption over the next 90 days
• 
  Episode 184-Stepping Off the Treadmill: Ginny Johnson on Sabbaticals, Career Transitions, and the Future of Legal Careers 27.09.2026 48m

  What happens when a successful lawyer decides to step away from a demanding career without having the next job lined up? My guest on this episode of Counsel to Counsel, Ginny Johnson, did just that. After more than two decades in the legal profession, including senior positions at major law firms and leadership roles at several corporations, Ginny decided to take a sabbatical. She used the time to travel, focus on her health, think about what she wanted next, and embark on what became a turbocharged networking and listening tour. Ginny spoke with hundreds of lawyers, business leaders, investors, and other professionals. What began as an exploration of her own next chapter ultimately became the foundation for a paper examining artificial intelligence, the changing legal market, and the future of legal careers. Those conversations also changed Ginny's thinking about her own career. Rather than simply moving into another traditional general counsel role, she recently joined Outside GC as a partner, providing fractional and interim legal leadership and strategic advice to businesses. In our conversation, we talk about Ginny's career journey from BigLaw litigation to in-house leadership, why she decided to take a sabbatical after 23 years of working continuously, and what she gained by giving herself permission to step away. We also discuss the extraordinary role networking has played throughout her career, the expanding responsibilities of general counsel, how AI may reshape legal careers and the traditional law firm apprenticeship model, and why experienced lawyers may have new opportunities to build more flexible, portfolio-style careers. Most importantly, Ginny's experience offers a useful lesson for lawyers who are feeling stuck or uncertain about what comes next. Sometimes creating space, talking to people, gathering information, and remaining open to possibilities can lead you somewhere you hadn't originally planned to go. Key Takeaways Careers don't have to be linear. A career move doesn't always have to mean a bigger title or more compensation. Sometimes a lateral move, a step back, or even a break can create opportunities for growth. Relationships create career opportunities. Except for her first law firm job, every major career move Ginny has made resulted from someone in her network connecting her with an opportunity. Going in-house requires a different mindset. Ginny discusses learning to communicate more succinctly, understand the business deeply, and give executives an actual recommendation rather than simply explaining all the possible legal outcomes. A sabbatical can create valuable perspective. After 23 years of working continuously, Ginny stepped away without another job lined up. She used the time to travel, focus on her health, reflect on what she wanted, and explore different possibilities for her next chapter. Networking can be a form of research. Ginny's listening tour grew to more than 500 conversations. Those conversations expanded her network, helped her understand how the legal market is changing, and ultimately became the foundation for her research paper. AI is changing legal work and creating new career possibilities. Ginny sees opportunities for experienced lawyers to provide fractional, interim, and strategic advice without working as a full-time general counsel or within a traditional law firm structure. At the same time, AI raises important questions about how junior lawyers will develop the experience and judgment they need. Judgment, relationships, and context remain critical. AI can produce work much faster, but experienced lawyers are still needed to determine whether the output is accurate, understand what it may have missed, and apply strategic judgment to a client's particular circumstances. In This Episode 01:36 – Ginny's journey from BigLaw litigator to general counsel and chief legal officer 05:59 – How networking helped Ginny make the move in-house 10:28 – What lawyers need to learn when moving from private practice to business 16:30 – Taking a sabbatical after 23 years without another job lined up 24:24 – Health span, career longevity, and not waiting too long to enjoy life 28:56 – Turning a networking tour into more than 500 conversations and a research paper 33:03 – AI, the expanding GC role, and the emerging advisory economy 41:02 – What remains uniquely valuable about lawyers in the age of AI
• 
  Episode 183: From Practicing Law to Consulting with Law Firms on Strategy, Operations, and Growth 14.09.2026 42m

  One of the questions I hear most frequently from lawyers who are unhappy practicing law is: What else can I do with a law degree? Making that transition can be difficult, particularly when you've spent years building expertise and credibility as a lawyer and suddenly find yourself trying to convince employers that your skills translate to something very different. My guest on this episode of Counsel to Counsel is Shireen Hilal, CEO of Maior, a consulting firm that helps law firms and other professional services firms improve their strategy, operations, growth, and profitability. Shireen began her career as a BigLaw litigator and practiced for about a decade before moving to the business side of professional services. She went on to hold senior roles at BDO and KPMG, served as COO of a national law firm, led growth for a communications consulting firm, and ultimately launched her own consulting business. What makes Shireen's story particularly useful for lawyers contemplating a career change is that she did not have an MBA or a traditional background in business, strategy, or operations. She had to figure out how to translate her legal experience into something employers could understand and value. She also had to deal with a lot of rejection along the way. In our conversation, we discuss how she figured out what interested her, how she broke into her first nonlegal role, the value of persistence and preparation, and which skills from practicing law proved most transferable. We also talk about the importance of curiosity, networking, taking initiative, and being willing to do more than simply submit a résumé. For lawyers who know they want something different but aren't sure what comes next, Shireen's career is a good reminder that leaving legal practice does not mean throwing away your legal training. Key Takeaways Your first move out of legal practice may be the hardest one. Shireen sent out many résumés and experienced a lot of rejection before BDO was willing to take a chance on her. She also took a pay cut to make the transition. Applying for jobs may not be enough. Shireen tried to identify the decision-maker and contact that person directly, explaining why she was interested and what she thought she could contribute despite lacking the traditional experience. Networking and persistence can help bridge the experience gap. Shireen succeeded largely through cold outreach, but we also discuss why relationships can make a career transition easier and why being able to hear "no" and keep going matters. Taking initiative can change the trajectory of your career. As a first-year associate doing document review, Shireen identified important documents, organized them, and brought them directly to the senior partner. That initiative quickly led to greater responsibility. Legal skills can be highly transferable. Attention to detail, problem-solving, preparation, curiosity, understanding facts, and figuring out what actually needs to get done have all been valuable throughout Shireen's business career. Explore before deciding what comes next. If you know you want to leave practice but don't know what you want to do instead, talk to people about their work. Learn what they actually do every day. Curiosity can help you identify possibilities you might not otherwise have considered. Leaving practice doesn't mean throwing away your legal training. Shireen believes her experience practicing law and running a law firm remains an important part of the value and credibility she brings to her consulting clients. Preparation can compensate for a lack of experience. Before interviewing for a chief of staff role at a major airline, Shireen studied the company and its competitors extensively. Her advice to lawyers is to use what they already know how to do well: dig into the facts, develop conclusions, and demonstrate how they would approach the job. Timestamps 00:05 – What else can you do with a law degree? 02:09 – Shireen's path from BigLaw litigation to the business side 10:13 – Realizing traditional legal practice wasn't the right fit 13:19 – Breaking into business without an MBA or traditional business background 16:19 – Networking, cold outreach, rejection, and persistence 21:00 – The legal skills that transfer to business roles 34:05 – What to do when you want to leave law but don't know what comes next 38:40 – Why leaving practice doesn't mean throwing away your legal training
• 
  Episode 182: How Lawyers Can Develop a Thicker Skin and Become More Resilient—with Dr. Larry Richard 01.09.2026 53m

  Why are lawyers so good at spotting problems and sometimes so bad at letting them go? For more than two decades, I've followed the research of Dr. Larry Richard, widely recognized as the leading expert on the psychology of lawyer behavior. His work has had a profound impact on my own career and provides a foundation for much of the coaching work I do with lawyers. His research has helped me understand not only my clients, but also my own tenancies and why so many of us who went to law school think and react the way we do. In this episode of Counsel to Counsel, Larry joins me to discuss his new book, Thin-Skinned: Why Lawyers Are So Low in Resilience, and the New Science That Can Help, that he co-authored with his wife Dr. D'Arcy Lyness (published by the American Bar Association.) Larry's research shows that lawyers differ significantly from the general population on a number of personality traits. Most strikingly, 90% of lawyers score below the 50th percentile for psychological resilience compared to the general public. The same skepticism and problem-spotting abilities that help us practice law effectively can make us more prone to negative thinking, defensiveness, and difficulty dealing with uncertainty, criticism, and change. The encouraging news is that resilience is highly learnable. Larry explains the practical ways that lawyers can strengthen their resilience by reducing negative thinking, increasing positive emotions, developing stronger social connections, and taking better care of themselves. We also discuss how these ideas apply to career development, business development, leadership, feedback, and the everyday challenges lawyers face. I've practiced and recommended many of these techniques for years including mindfulness, gratitude, exercise, cultivating relationships, and challenging negative thinking. Thin-Skinned gave me a much deeper understanding of why they work and offers many new ideas that I can use both personally and with my coaching clients. Key Takeaways Lawyers really are psychologically different. Larry's decades of research identify seven traits on which lawyers tend to be outliers: skepticism, autonomy, abstract reasoning, urgency, sociability, cognitive empathy, and resilience. The traits that make us effective lawyers can work against us elsewhere. Skepticism and looking for what could go wrong are enormously valuable when practicing law, but carrying that mindset into our personal and professional relationships can undermine resilience. Being "thin-skinned" doesn't mean being weak. A lawyer may confidently handle an aggressive opposing counsel yet become defensive when a colleague questions their behavior. Ambiguous interpersonal situations are often where low resilience shows up. Resilience can be learned. Unlike many personality traits, resilience is heavily influenced by learning and experience, which means there are concrete things we can do to improve it. Thoughts, feelings, and actions reinforce one another. Changing any one of the three can influence the others. For lawyers who struggle with rejection in business development or career advancement, simply taking action repeatedly can reduce the sense of threat over time. Positive emotions aren't just "feel-good" exercises. Music, gratitude, nature, exercise, and other positive experiences have measurable effects that can help counteract the physiological impact of stress and negative emotions. Relationships are a powerful source of resilience. Strong, authentic social connections help us absorb stress and cope with change. That is particularly important for lawyers, who tend to score lower on sociability. Law firm leaders need to understand lawyer resilience. Leaders who default to fixing deficiencies and react defensively to suggestions can undermine trust. Strengths-based leadership and an understanding of how low-resilience lawyers respond to feedback can produce better results. Timestamps 00:04 – Why Dr. Larry Richard's work has influenced my career and coaching 05:44 – The seven personality traits that make lawyers different 09:44 – Why 90% of lawyers are "thin-skinned" 16:36 – The good news: resilience can be learned 21:01 – The science and importance of positive emotions 28:03 – Taking action despite fear, uncertainty, and rejection 37:20 – Where to start if building resilience feels overwhelming 44:40 – What law firm leaders can do to build more resilient workplaces About Dr. Larry Richard Dr. Larry Richard began his career as a lawyer before earning a Ph.D. in psychology and devoting his career to studying lawyers and lawyer behavior. His research has helped law firms and lawyers better understand leadership, management, well-being, personality, and change. His new book, Thin-Skinned: Why Lawyers Are So Low in Resilience, and the New Science That Can Help, co-authored with Dr. D'Arcy Lyness, is available from the American Bar Association. Larry describes it not simply as an explanation of why lawyers struggle with resilience, but as a practical collection of evidence-based strategies for doing something about it. Learn more about Dr. Richard, his work, and the book at https://www.lawyerbrain.com/.
• 
  Episode 181: Legal Marketing for New Law Firm Launches with Michele Correnti 12.08.2026 44m

  In this episode, Stephen Seckler speaks with Michele Correnti about branding, websites, LinkedIn, content marketing, and how AI is changing the way law firms market themselves. They discuss  what lawyers should do before and after launching a solo or small firm to build visibility, attract the right clients, and stay top of mind with referral sources. Michele Correnti, founder and CEO of Correnti Marketing, shares practical advice drawn from years of working with law firms and other professional service businesses. If you're thinking about launching a practice or rethinking your firm's online presence, this conversation is packed with tactical guidance. Key Takeaways Branding is more than a logo. Start marketing before launch day. Specificity attracts better clients. Niches can expand opportunity. Personal branding matters. LinkedIn should be used strategically. Websites should reflect the real audience. AI is a tool, not a replacement. Timestamps 00:00 - Why legal marketing matters after launching a firm 00:48 - Why potential clients won't find you automatically 01:16 - Michele Correnti's background in professional services marketing 03:43 - Photography, headshots, and visual branding 05:15 - What to do six months before leaving a firm 07:50 - Why your brand is really your reputation 09:16 - Using an ideal client to sharpen your message 16:04 - Personal LinkedIn profiles versus company pages 19:15 - How AI is changing SEO and search visibility 23:00 - Common online presence mistakes lawyers make 27:09 - Launching a firm as a coordinated campaign 32:58 - Where AI helps and where the human voice still matters 37:17 - The risks and opportunities of AI-generated images 40:47 - Three marketing priorities for the first 90 days
• 
  Episode 180-Thinking About Starting Your Own Law Firm? Avoid These Ethical Mistakes (With Mike Rossi) 26.07.2026 36m

  Starting your own law firm can be one of the most exciting and rewarding career moves a lawyer can make. But amid the excitement of choosing a name, finding clients, and building a practice, it's easy to overlook ethical and operational issues that can create problems down the road. In this episode, Steve Seckler speaks with Mike Rossi, a partner at the law firm Conn Kavanaugh in Boston. Mike focuses on professional liability, business litigation, and advising lawyers and law firms on professional responsibility and risk management. Together, they walk through the ethical and practical issues lawyers should think about when starting a new practice, especially the decisions that need to be made before a firm opens its doors. The conversation begins with the obligations lawyers have when leaving a firm, including how to notify clients appropriately and why client choice matters. Mike explains the importance of handling departures harmoniously, avoiding premature client outreach, and understanding the fiduciary duties involved in a transition. The episode explores marketing and business development and operational issues. Mike and Steve also discuss supervision responsibilities, the ethical use of AI tools, co-counsel arrangements, referral disclosures, and the risks that can arise when lawyers take on unfamiliar matters too quickly. This episode is a reminder that a little prevention early on can save a lot of trouble later. Key Takeaways Leaving a firm starts with your obligations to the firm and your clients, not your new business plan. Clients ultimately choose where their matters go, and a joint communication is the safest way to notify them. Legal tech competence is part of modern professional competence, so your systems should be ready on day one. IOLTA and trust accounting are high-risk areas for new solos and deserve careful setup before taking client funds. Marketing must avoid false or misleading claims, especially around results, specialization, and expertise. AI, supervision, and conflict checks all require active oversight; "set it and forget it" creates risk. Key Topics Ethical obligations when leaving a law firm and managing client relationships How to navigate conflicts of interest, client notifications, and joint communications Essential technology and systems for risk management, including trust accounts and practice management tools Marketing and advertising rules: do's and don'ts for building your brand online The role of AI and emerging technologies in legal practice and supervision responsibilities Best practices for growth: supervision, hiring, and managing non-lawyer participation Preparing for launch: conflict checks, IOLTA setup, and ethical pitfalls to avoid Timestamps 00:40 - Responsibilities of law firm owners beyond client acquisition 01:37 - Ethical challenges: client intake, conflicts, and engagement letters 05:24 - ABA guidance on leaving a firm and client transition rules 06:16 - Client autonomy in choosing where matters go 12:08 - Ethical duty of technological competence and practice management tools 13:48 - Trust accounting: setting up compliant IOLTA accounts 16:13 - Advertising and online marketing rules 28:44 - Using AI tools responsibly and supervising outputs
• 
  Episode 179: Beyond Law Firms: Careers in Law Schools and Nonprofits 11.07.2026 30m

  Many lawyers assume their career options begin and end with practicing law. In this episode, Steve speaks with Tony Waller, a lawyer, educator, former nonprofit CEO, and career development leader whose career demonstrates the many ways a legal education can lead to meaningful and rewarding work. Tony discusses his journey from private practice to recruiting, law school career services, nonprofit leadership, and higher education administration. Along the way, he shares practical advice for lawyers and law students who are considering career transitions, searching for more meaningful work, or wondering how to leverage their legal skills outside of traditional practice. Whether you're happy practicing law or considering a different path, this conversation will broaden your perspective on what a successful legal career can look like. Key Takeaways Your legal skills are highly transferable and can create opportunities well beyond traditional legal practice. Career transitions are most successful when they're intentional rather than reactions to temporary dissatisfaction. Lawyers need to become comfortable identifying and communicating the value they bring to employers and clients. Law schools offer rewarding career paths in career development, student affairs, advancement, and administration. Volunteer leadership and nonprofit board service can expand your network while developing valuable leadership skills. Strong professional relationships often lead to career opportunities before positions are ever publicly posted. Before making a career change, identify exactly what is making you unhappy so you don't repeat the same mistakes. Career success isn't a race—focus on continuous growth rather than comparing your timeline to others. Timestamps 00:00 Introduction and Tony Waller's unconventional legal career 04:05 Why Tony left legal practice and the transferable skills lawyers possess 12:05 Career opportunities for lawyers in law school administration 15:20 Transitioning into nonprofit leadership and serving as a CEO 20:30 Networking, relationship building, and the hidden job market 22:45 How legal career development has changed over the past two decades 25:00 Advice for lawyers considering a career transition 29:45 Final career advice and Tony's recommendation for the TV series Shrinking Connect with Tony Waller Tony Waller University of Georgia School of Law Email: twaller@uga.edu Connect with Steve Seckler To schedule a free 30-minute consultation or access free career, leadership, and business development resources for lawyers, visit www.seckler.com. If you enjoyed this episode, please subscribe, leave a review, and share it with a colleague who may be exploring new career possibilities.
• 
  Episode 178-Becoming a Legal Recruiter: Navigating an Alternative Legal Career with Matt Miller 27.06.2026 36m

  In this episode, Steve sits down with Matt Miller to discuss Matt's unconventional journey from practicing lawyer to what he describes as an "accidental tourist" in legal recruiting. They explore why he doesn't subscribe to the familiar "recovering lawyer" narrative, what he has learned from observing thousands of legal careers, the surprising value of a legal education, and how our priorities, definitions of success, and career choices often evolve over time.   Matt is a lawyer, entrepreneur, recruiter, and legal industry innovator whose career has taken him through Big Law, boutique practice, law firm partnership, and an in-house role as General Counsel. Along the way, he founded a legal recruiting firm and more recently launched an AI-powered job search platform designed to help lawyers navigate their careers more effectively.   Whether you're considering going in-house, transitioning out of practice, or exploring entrepreneurship, Matt's insights challenge traditional narratives and offer practical guidance.   Key takeaways   A legal career can evolve in many directions, and those pivots can create unexpected opportunities. Going in-house can be appealing, but timing and fit matter more than many lawyers realize. Relationships and networking often shape careers more than formal plans do. It helps to think long term about career decisions instead of reacting only to the next move. Vulnerability, coaching, and honest conversations can create real clarity. Lawyers have more flexibility than they think, especially when they stay open to new paths.   Timestamps   00:00 - Welcome and episode overview 01:07 - Matt's background and journey into law and entrepreneurship 03:44 - Early career choices and the move through private practice 07:00 - What lawyers should consider before transitioning in-house 14:10 - Intentionality versus opportunity-driven career moves 18:10 - Why relationships matter throughout a legal career   Links   Jolo.ai – AI-powered legal job platform Ascent Counsel
• 
  Episode 177-Understanding Executive Functioning and Its Impact on Lawyers' Performance 13.06.2026 32m

  In this episode, Steve Seckler speaks with Dr. Sarah Alsaidi, a psychologist, executive coach, and creator of the Brain in Mind Method, a coaching framework that integrates neuroscience and psychology to help high-performing professionals better understand how their brains work and perform at their best. Dr. Alsaidi explores the critical role of executive functioning in high-performing legal professionals. She demystifies how these mental skills influence productivity, resilience, and well-being, offering practical insights for lawyers and their organizations. This episode offers a blend of neuroscience, practical coaching strategies, and insights into the unique challenges faced by legal professionals, making it a valuable listen for anyone looking to enhance their cognitive skills and resilience in high-stakes careers. Key Takeaways: Executive functioning is like the brain's CEO, involving skills such as planning, organization, and emotional regulation. Microaggressions and cultural factors can significantly impact cognitive functions and focus. Distinguishing between perfectionism and healthy ambition is crucial for sustainable performance. Metacognition, or thinking about your thinking, is essential for identifying effective tools and strategies. Emotional regulation is vital for managing stress and maintaining resilience in high-pressure environments. Timestamps: 00:00 - Introduction and guest background 02:00 - Relevance of executive skills in legal practice 04:00 - Impact of microaggressions and sociocultural factors on cognition 06:50 - Behavior patterns linked to executive function challenges 11:15 - The importance of giving tools time to work 16:00 - Normalizing individual differences in the workplace 23:00 - Practical tools for self-assessment and improvement 30:00 - Supporting colleagues with executive functioning challenges
• 
  Episode 176-What Makes for a Happy Lawyer or Successful Associate? 27.05.2026 40m

  In this episode, Steve's guest, Paul Karvanis, delves into redefining success and happiness within the legal profession. Paul, a former lawyer turned coach, speaker, and author, shares his journey from practicing law to coaching, emphasizing the importance of aligning career goals with personal values. His books, The Happy Lawyer and The Successful Associate, provide a roadmap for lawyers seeking fulfillment beyond traditional achievements. Paul discusses the traps lawyers often fall into, the significance of self-awareness, and the role of community and self-compassion in achieving sustainable success. Key takeaways: Success is personal; align work with your values for true satisfaction. Sustainable happiness comes from action, not just awareness. Adopt an ownership mindset for continuous growth and mastery. Excellence requires a dynamic loop of reflection and action. Build supportive communities and practice self-compassion for resilience. Embrace imperfect action to overcome overthinking and accelerate growth. Timestamps: 00:00 - Introduction: Success vs. happiness in law 02:11 - Meet Paul Karvanis: Background and focus 05:38 - The Happy Lawyer Project origin 10:04 - Chasing traditional success vs. fulfillment 14:42 - Studying thriving lawyers 20:28 - Foundations for thriving: Community and self-compassion 26:29 - Why lawyers delay change until crises 35:25 - Correct work vs. useful work
• 
  Episode 175-Making Strategic Lateral Moves: Insights for Law Firm Partners from a Top Legal Recruiter 09.05.2026 38m

  In this episode, Scott Love, a renowned legal recruiter and host of the Rainmaking Podcast, delves into the complexities of lateral partner transitions within law firms. Scott shares his wealth of experience, offering listeners a roadmap to navigate these high-stakes decisions effectively. From understanding the motivations behind partner moves to the strategic importance of building trust and conducting thorough due diligence, Scott provides actionable insights to help partners avoid common pitfalls and achieve successful transitions. Key Takeaways: Surge in Lateral Moves: Discover why lateral moves are increasing and what firms are looking for in new partners. Motivations for Change: Explore common reasons for partner transitions, including leadership and strategy issues. Building Trust: Learn the importance of trust and relationship-building in legal business development. Due Diligence: Gain a step-by-step guide to assessing opportunities and avoiding costly mistakes. Common Mistakes: Understand the pitfalls partners often encounter, such as unrealistic expectations about client portability and integration challenges. Successful Transitions: Understand the role of process, connection points, and force multipliers in seamless integrations. Ethics and Timing: Learn about the ethical considerations and strategic timing crucial for minimizing risks. Timestamps: 00:00 - Introduction to lateral partner movement 01:01 - Scott Love's background in legal recruiting 05:37 - Strategic reasons for partner moves 10:45 - Navigating moves effectively with a clear process 18:10 - Common mistakes in lateral moves 20:22 - What firms seek in new partners 26:47 - Trust-building and successful recruiting moves 35:20 - Final advice for partners considering a move Resources: Partners on the Move - Scott's process hub and resources Rainmaking Podcast - Scott's podcast on business development for lawyers Steve Seckler's appearance on the Rainmaking Podcast Connect with Scott Love: LinkedIn Email
• 
  Episode 174-How Self-Awareness Increases Your Effectiveness in Managing Your Legal Team 27.04.2026 35m

  Self-awareness is an important and often overlooked skill in a lawyer's toolkit. Personality and behavioral assessments like DISC can be used in a practical, grounded way to help lawyers better understand their strengths, spot blind spots, improve communication, and show up more effectively with clients, colleagues, and prospects. To unpack how these tools can be used well (and where they can be misused), Steve is joined in this episode by John Kormanik, a Professional Certified Coach who works with lawyers around the world and the author of Break the Law: A Story of a Reimagined Career and a Reclaimed Life. Before launching his coaching practice, John spent more than 20 years as a practicing attorney, including serving as a Deputy Attorney General, working in private practice, and owning and leading his own law firm for 16 years. This experience informs his practical approach to helping lawyers lead with intention. Key Takeaways: Self-awareness is crucial for lawyers to enhance leadership and client relationships. DISC assessments help improve communication within legal teams. Understanding natural vs. adapted states can help overcome fixed mindsets. Cultural experiences can significantly influence communication styles. Networking and continuous personal evolution are vital for career success. Introverts and extroverts can expand their influence by being authentic. Assessments are tools for awareness, not fixed definitions of personality. Timestamps: 00:00 - Introduction to self-awareness in legal coaching 01:02 - John Kormanik's career path from attorney to coach 03:16 - How John works with lawyer clients and addressing leadership challenges 05:58 - Embracing international practice and client acquisition 09:11 - Building international networks through events, workshops, and online platforms 13:23 - How legal experience shapes coaching approach and pushing clients 18:39 - Deep dive into DISC components and their application 23:38 - Clarifying DISC components: D, I, S, C 28:56 - Effective moments and applications of assessments in legal practice 35:01 - Continuous growth and the importance of not defining oneself by assessments
• 
  Episode 173-Managing a Demanding Career While Caring for an Aging Parent 11.04.2026 33m

  In this episode, Steve Seckler speaks with Amy Mariani, a Boston-based mediator and former litigator. She shares her deeply personal journey navigating her professional life alongside caring for her mother with dementia. Her story offers valuable guidance for professionals facing similar challenges, emphasizing resilience, resources, and the importance of community. This episode underscores the importance of early planning, community support, and embracing the skills caregiving can foster, all while balancing a demanding career. Whether you're in the midst of caregiving or preparing for it ahead of time, Amy's insights and resources offer valuable guidance. Note: Amy appeared on Counsel to Counsel in 2021 when she was in the midst of her family crisis. At that time, she only spoke about her transition to mediation; but clearly a lot was going on then in her personal life.  You can listen here or wherever you get your podcasts. Episode 75-Shifting Your Litigation Practice to Mediation    Main Topics: The emotional and logistical complexities of caring for an aging parent with dementia How caregiving impacts professional life and work-life balance The benefits of family communication, mediating sibling relationships, and utilizing caregiver resources Key Insights: Amy's early recognition of her mother's dementia symptoms and the timeline of care The role of senior care managers in easing decision-making and reducing familial conflict Strategies for professionals to continue working effectively while caregiving The importance of establishing plans early, including involving future generations and professionals How caregiving enhances skills like patience, active listening, and emotional resilience—valuable assets for mediators and others Creating support networks, such as groups for children of aging parents, to share experiences and resources The societal need for more open discussion about aging and eldercare support Timestamps: 00:00 - Introduction: Focus of the episode and guest background 02:23 - Amy's experience caring for her parents during the pandemic 05:26 - Explanation of the "sandwich generation" and caregiving responsibilities 06:32 - How Amy's caregiving journey began and evolving challenges 09:07 - Recognizing early symptoms and family dynamics in caregiving 21:12 - How caregiving improved Amy's skills as a mediator  
• 
  Episode 172-Boundaries, Burnout, and Building a Sustainable Legal Career with Gary Miles 29.03.2026 31m

  In this episode, Gary Miles delves into the pervasive issue of burnout in the legal profession and offers practical strategies for establishing healthy boundaries. Drawing from his extensive experience, Gary discusses the role of perfectionism and fear in contributing to lawyer stress and burnout. He emphasizes the importance of shifting from external validation to internal authority, which can significantly impact mental well-being and career satisfaction. The conversation also explores the concept of sustainable excellence, encouraging lawyers to redefine success and create practices that align with their personal values. Gary shares personal transformation stories and provides actionable steps for lawyers feeling trapped by their success or struggling with career transitions. This episode is a must-listen for legal professionals seeking to build a fulfilling and sustainable career. Takeaways: Understanding how perfectionism and fear contribute to burnout Implementing effective boundary-setting techniques Shifting from external to internal authority for better mental health Redefining success through sustainable excellence Practical advice for lawyers facing career transitions The importance of delegation and team-building to reduce stress Debunking the myth of immediate responsiveness Timestamps: 00:00 - Introduction: Addressing lawyer burnout and the importance of boundaries 01:33 - Exploring dissatisfaction despite career success 06:42 - Setting healthy boundaries in legal practice 13:50 - How internal versus external authority influences self-worth and stress 20:46 - Achieving sustainable excellence through delegation and building teams 25:15 - The four pillars for evaluating a fulfilling legal career 30:46 - One simple, actionable step for setting boundaries this week Resources & Links: Gary Miles - Website Gary Miles - LinkedIn Lawyers Concerned for Lawyers (Massachusetts) Lawyers Assistance Program - National Association of State Legal Assistance Programs Connect with Gary Miles: LinkedIn Email If you found this episode helpful, please share it with colleagues and leave a review on your favorite podcast platform. For a personalized coaching session, visit secler.com for a free 30-minute consultation.
• 
  Episode 171-A Career in Legal Operations with Jeff Kruse 14.03.2026 34m

  Legal operations has evolved from a back-office function into a strategic discipline that is reshaping how legal services are delivered. In this conversation, Stephen Seckler speaks with legal operations consultant Jeff Kruse about how technology, process improvement, and artificial intelligence are transforming the way law firms and legal departments work. Jeff shares insights from his career path, from product liability defense lawyer to in-house chief litigation officer and eventually a legal operations consultant. The discussion explores how legal operations helps organizations improve efficiency, manage risk, and adapt to rapid technological change. They also discuss how lawyers considering career transitions can leverage their transferable skills in new roles such as legal operations, consulting, or mediation. The episode concludes with a look at the future of legal operations and why the field is becoming increasingly strategic in law firms and corporate legal departments. Key Takeaways Legal operations has evolved from a back-office function into a strategic discipline AI is accelerating change in legal departments and law firms Process improvements often start with the people doing the day-to-day work "Trickle-up improvementnomics" can improve efficiency across an organization Change management is often the biggest obstacle to operational improvements Lawyers possess transferable skills that apply beyond practicing law Redundancy and backup systems are essential for managing technological risk Legal operations is becoming increasingly strategic within law firms and corporate legal departments Timestamps 00:00 Introduction and why legal operations is now critical 01:03 Jeff Kruse's background and career path 02:20 From law firm partner to in-house litigation leadership 06:16 Jeff's work as a mediator and what it taught him 08:18 Remote and hybrid work in legal teams before the pandemic 10:11 How remote work influences legal operations thinking 11:12 What legal operations actually includes 14:07 AI and the accelerating pace of change in the legal industry 15:44 Can small firms and legal departments keep up with AI? 19:23 Technology consolidation and evaluating legal tech vendors 21:10 What a legal hold is and why it matters 23:00 "Trickle-Up Improvementnomics" and operational efficiency 27:01 Why change management is difficult in legal organizations 34:01 Lessons from the Amazon Web Services outage 37:45 The future of legal operations 40:37 Closing remarks and coaching resources
• 
  Episode 170-Shauna Bryce on How to use (and Not to Use) AI in a Job Search 26.02.2026 40m

  In this episode, Steve talks with Shauna Bryce of Bryce Legal about finding the right balance between AI tools and old-fashioned relationship-building in today's legal job market. Shauna shares concrete examples of how AI can speed up research, clarify goals, and help lawyers target the right employers. They also dig into the common missteps lawyers make, especially relying on AI to write résumés or to generate content without verifying accuracy. Shauna explains how strategic positioning still requires human insight and an understanding of what hiring managers actually care about. Ultimately, the conversation reinforces that networking, trust, and genuine human interaction remain central to career advancement. For lawyers exploring new opportunities, this episode offers a grounded perspective on using AI thoughtfully without losing sight of what matters most. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to AI in Job Search 02:38 Shauna Bryce's Career Journey 05:34 Transitioning to Coaching 08:25 Role as Chief Talent Officer 10:55 Current Coaching Business Overview 14:01 Long-term Client Engagements 16:45 Impact on Diverse Lawyers 19:33 Using AI Effectively in Job Searches 22:16 Common Missteps with AI in Job Searches 23:31 The Role of AI in Resume Writing 28:39 The Importance of Networking in Job Searches 35:41 Building and Expanding Your Network 37:48 Using AI for Interview Preparation 40:47 Balancing AI and Human Relationships in Job Searches
• 
  Episode 169-Creating a Blueprint to Launch Your Solo Law Practice--with Anthonia Berry 15.02.2026 33m

  In this episode, Stephen Seckler interviews Anthonia Berry, a legal marketing and business development strategist, about her new program, Building Your Own Practice Blueprint. The program is designed to help lawyers transition from traditional employment to running their own practices. They discuss the challenges lawyers face in launching a practice, the importance of mindset, and the necessity of building a support network. Anthonia emphasizes the need for financial preparedness and the value of seeking expert advice to navigate the complexities of starting a law practice. Takeaways Strategy Academy helps attorneys generate new revenue streams. The Building Your Own Practice Blueprint is designed for lawyers transitioning to solo practice. Many lawyers feel overwhelmed when starting their own practice. The program provides a self-guided step-by-step roadmap to avoid common mistakes. Mindset shift from attorney to business owner is crucial. Attorneys should have at least six months of savings before launching a practice. Building a support network is essential for success. Investing in the right resources is key to maintaining a practice. Understanding financials is critical for sustainability. Cultural experiences shape perspectives on law and business. Chapters 00:00 Introduction to Strategy Academy 01:34 Understanding the Building Your Own Practice Blueprint 08:25 Navigating the Transition from Employee to Entrepreneur 14:39 Common Challenges in Starting a Practice 17:28 Building a Support Network for Success 20:43 Balancing Expenses and Investments in Your Law Practice 24:35 Financial Preparedness for Launching a Law Practice 27:09 Philosophy of Seeking Help and Embracing Change 29:56 Cultural Perspectives on Law and Business 32:45 Final Advice for Lawyers Aspiring to Start Their Own Law Practice 34:03 Recommended Reading for Growth
• 
  Episode 168-Matt Selig of Health Law Advocates: Practicing Public Interest Law 31.01.2026 32m

  In this episode, Stephen Seckler interviews Matt Selig, the Executive Director of Health Law Advocates (HLA), a nonprofit organization dedicated to improving healthcare access for vulnerable populations in Massachusetts. They discuss HLA's mission, various advocacy programs, the evolution of healthcare policies, and the challenges faced in public interest law. Matt shares insights from his career journey, the skills needed for success in this field, and the importance of pro bono work. The conversation also touches on funding sources for HLA, the rewards and challenges of public interest law, and the organization's approach to addressing secondary trauma among its staff. Takeaways Health Law Advocates provides free legal services to vulnerable populations. The organization focuses on improving healthcare access for those at risk. Advocacy programs include mental health, immigrant healthcare, and disability rights. Public interest law requires passion for the mission and hard work. Experience in legal aid is highly valued in hiring at HLA. Pro bono work is a great way to transition into public interest law. Funding for HLA comes from state budgets, grants, and individual contributions. The work in public interest law can be rewarding despite challenges. Leadership roles in nonprofits can be achieved through growth within the organization 00:00 Introduction to Health Law Advocates 01:21 Mission and Activities of HLA 04:52 Legal Issues and Advocacy Programs 10:10 Evolution of HLA's Mission 12:39 Matt Selig's Career Journey 14:26 Skills for Success in Public Interest Law 16:23 Hiring Practices at HLA 17:56 Transitioning from Private Practice to Public Interest 19:17 Funding Sources for HLA 20:24 Pro Bono Opportunities at HLA 22:08 Rewards and Challenges of Public Interest Work 24:15 Addressing Secondary Trauma 26:58 Transitioning to Executive Director Role 32:34 Advice for Aspiring Public Interest Lawyers
• 
  Episode 167-From Litigation to Mediation with Oran Kaufman 17.01.2026 28m

  In this episode, Stephen Seckler speaks with Oran Kaufman, a mediator with an extensive background in family law. They discuss Oran's journey from litigation to mediation, the skills required to be a mediator, and how mediation has changed over the last 30 years. Oran shares insights on the differences between mediation and litigation, the importance of listening, and the challenges of building a mediation practice. The conversation also touches on collaborative law, alternative legal careers, and the impact of technology on mediation. Takeaways Mediation requires a different skill set than litigation. Listening is a crucial skill for both mediators and lawyers. Transitioning from litigation to mediation can lower work related stress. Collaborative law offers an alternative to traditional litigation. Silence can be a powerful tool in mediation. There are several challenges in building a mediation practice that differ from building a law practice. Technology has expanded the reach of mediation services. Timeline 00:00 Introduction and Background 03:17 Oran Kaufman's Journey into Family Mediation 05:45 Transitioning from Litigation to Mediation 08:47 The Nature of Family Mediation 11:38 Skills and Challenges of Mediation 13:58 Building a Mediation Practice 16:21 Collaborative Law and Mediation 18:50 Qualities of a Good Mediator 21:44 Exploring Alternative Legal Careers 24:29 The Evolution of Mediation